Virus - Paph villosum?

[The Mutant]

So, I've had this little guy for 2½ years now, and finally I decided to ask what on earth could be going on with it.

As soon as I got it home, it started getting chlorotic leaves like this:



My theories have ranged from, virus, nutrient deficiency, light issue, to variegation.

It has been growing right next to my other Paphs from the Paphiopedilum subgenus, getting the same treatment, culture, fertilizer, you name it, and none of the other have ever shown any signs of similar issues.

There's no pitting, no cell collapse, no deformations etc; just the lack of green colour. The leaves also green up after a while, which is why the older ones are greener, but they never go fully green.

It's a good grower and seems healthy and happy if it wasn't for the strange looking foliage...

EDIT 1:
I need to stop editing the post.
I posted this on Slippertalk as well, but thought it's always better to get more eyes looking at it. The only comment I've gotten there so far, says virus, so in wild panic, I threw myself out onto the web to check pictures of virused orchids. I can't find anything looking remotely like this, so I'm even more confused and concerned now...


EDIT 2:
Added some more pictures, The fourth picture is from when I got it home (it's still in the same pot, so it has grown quite a bit), the fifth picture is another villosum I had (bought it as a henryanum, though) for about a year, together with my helenae, which I had for about 2½ years before killing it.

The reason why I'm posting the last picture, is because these two stood at the same place as my weird villosum. They got exactly the same treatment, culture, everything, but none of them looked like this. So I don't think it's cultural.

[NYCorchidman]

If you are curious, why don't you test it for virus?
You cannot tell virus by just looking at it.
So whoever said it's got virus is wrong in the sense that one just cannot tell for sure by visual inspection, although good guessing is a possibility.

I have an amaryllis whose new leaves sometimes coming out with some clear area, but then they would green up in about couple of weeks.
not sure if my amaryllis is virused. lol
time to test, maybe. I hope lily virus does not transfer to orchids. oh, no!!!!

[The Mutant]

Originally Posted by NYCorchidman

If you are curious, why don't you test it for virus?
You cannot tell virus by just looking at it.
So whoever said it's got virus is wrong in the sense that one just cannot tell for sure by visual inspection, although good guessing is a possibility.

I have an amaryllis whose new leaves sometimes coming out with some clear area, but then they would green up in about couple of weeks.
not sure if my amaryllis is virused. lol
time to test, maybe. I hope lily virus does not transfer to orchids. oh, no!!!!

Because, it seems it's not that easy getting your hands on virus test-kits here in Europe, so I was hoping it would be easy to tell. After living on the web after a couple of days, I know this is not the case.

I've contacted what seems to be Agdia's distributor here in Europe, but I don't even know if they sell test-kits to hobby growers.

Problem #2; I don't even know which viruses to test for. Paphs seem a bit uncommon in showing symptoms of virus, even if they have it. The two most common ones, of course, but what else? Cucumber mosaic virus? Tobacco mosaic virus? Cymbidium ringspot virus?

It's looking more and more like it's the bin for this one.


EDIT:
I just tossed it. Couldn't stand the uncertainty anymore, even got a migraine because of this, and felt that it just wasn't worth it. Problem is that if it was virused, the probability of my entire collection being infected is high, since I've had it for such a long time, and although I keep everything sterilized, I've had mites. Oh well, too late now.

[wintergirl]

Originally Posted by The Mutant

EDIT:
I just tossed it. Couldn't stand the uncertainty anymore, even got a migraine because of this, and felt that it just wasn't worth it. Problem is that if it was virused, the probability of my entire collection being infected is high, since I've had it for such a long time, and although I keep everything sterilized, I've had mites. Oh well, too late now.

You did the right thing. I would have tossed it too. Hopefully no one else will get sick.

[The Mutant]

Originally Posted by wintergirl

You did the right thing. I would have tossed it too. Hopefully no one else will get sick.

Yep, it feels right, but not an easy thing to do. I've contacted Agdia and I'll see if I'll get some virus test strips to check the Paphs that have been standing the closest to the suspicious looking one. Just to be on the safe side.

[NYCorchidman]

Villosum being rather a common species and easy to grow, I think you did the right thing.
I'm not sure about the European branch, but people here buy Agdia home test kits.

I think these home test kits only test for two most common orchid viruses, but there are many many different kinds of virus that infect orchids.

Well, in the end, if something looks suspicious and drive you nuts, getting rid of it and finding peace of mind is the best thing to do.

[The Mutant]

Originally Posted by NYCorchidman

Villosum being rather a common species and easy to grow, I think you did the right thing.
I'm not sure about the European branch, but people here buy Agdia home test kits.

I think these home test kits only test for two most common orchid viruses, but there are many many different kinds of virus that infect orchids.

Well, in the end, if something looks suspicious and drive you nuts, getting rid of it and finding peace of mind is the best thing to do.

This one was a freebie from a vendor and it said "new type from China" on the tag, so this particular type probably won't be easy to get again. I'm not really into villosum, but I kept it because I wanted to see what it looked like when it flowered.

I don't regret tossing it though. I even got a migraine because of all the worry.


I'm in contact with Agdia and they have those tests for the two most common orchid viruses, but they have other tests, too. The problem is, which of the more uncommon viruses could it be? I'll see if they can help me narrow it down a bit. They seem very helpful.

[NYCorchidman]

I just read an article on the Chinese villosum. I think they are basically the same, with overall very washed out and diluted color, if you like that, but I like the intensely colored form the best. like annamense with yellow dorsal with very very dark vertical line on it.

Well, that's the thing about virus.
It gives me headache the more I think about it. lol

Also, tests only work for two most common one.
I'm sure certain lab will test for all the known orchid virus if you paid them enough. haha

I guess we will just have to practice good culture and whatever looks suspicious and does not do well will have to go.

[Fairorchids]

Actually, I have never heard of virus in Paphs. In Phals, Catts, Oncids & Cymbidiums yes (and up to several types, with tobacco & tomato mosaic virus being common).

If anyone has seen a study on virus in Paphs, I would like a link.

[Leafmite]

Originally Posted by Fairorchids

Actually, I have never heard of virus in Paphs. In Phals, Catts, Oncids & Cymbidiums yes (and up to several types, with tobacco & tomato mosaic virus being common).

If anyone has seen a study on virus in Paphs, I would like a link.

I have always heard this about Paphs, too. When I saw the pictures, I was surprised that it was suggested to have a virus. I would have thought it to be a nutrition deficiency of some sort or, perhaps even a genetic issue. I am more accustomed to pictures of orchids and other plants with viruses having necrotic streaks and markings or circular markings...perhaps even deformed leaves. This doesn't look classic for virus to me.