soap for orchid pest control

[tmoney]

well, if you've read a thread or 2 as of late you probly know our position on this topic and that i, personally, have found it very effective. really tho, i want to hear from the folks out there who are adamantly against the use of soap (in the form of a diluted spray) as a treatment for minor pest outbreaks. to summarize, i do feel that soap is an effective treatment against mites. beyond that, i have only observational qualitative data on the benefits of occasionally cleaning my plants with diluted soap spray.

so, why are some folks against it? what are the direct experiences that form that opinion?

now, i have been clear in my position from the get that if you are a commercial grower or have any sort of extended, outdoor (or massive indoor) grow space, then treating with soap may not be the best approach. especially if you are reliant on pristine plants at absolute optimum growth performance. thanks for keeping our sharing on the civil side, as i feel like i have been pushing buttons on this lately!!! sorry

Garden Myth: Is Dish Soap Safe for the Garden and the Science Behind It - Laidback Gardener

edit to add the one infection i found hard to calm down or get rid of was scale. i had that on some indoor ficus many years ago in indianapolis, and yeah, soap wasn't great on scale. but with mealys as well it has proven effective. so, that pretty much covers the range of typical indoor pests (not talking fungus yet or algea, or viruses...let's let the discussion mature!)

[Dimples]

I prefer to use soap-based pesticides that have been designed for use on plants to help avoid the potential negative effects of less-refined soaps, like phytotoxicity or stripping the cuticle, but I’ll add a drop or two of natural soap (skip the detergents) when I think some extra emulsification would be beneficial. Neem oil products are notorious for poorly mixing, and spraying plants with very waxy exteriors (eg. broccoli) is somewhat pointless without something to break the surface tension. I’ve even been known to grab the spray bottle of Ms. Meyers from under the sink and go to town on aphids and their ant caretakers residing on my cucumbers when the rage overcomes me.

However, when I was newer to the scientific side of growing plants, I strongly rejected the use of home remedies. The damage and downsides didn’t seem worth it, and humanity had developed products to solve all of our problems!! So why take the risk?!! I also enjoyed the slight sense of superiority that came from knowing “the right way” to do things. I suspect many people also get sucked into the marketing and sales tactics from “cutting edge” companies trying to sell the latest and greatest product that often turn out to be no better than the less expensive alternatives, or a complete sham.

Time + experience = more humility and understanding of nuance. While I’m still pro-plant-specific-products when possible, I understand the desire to use what’s on hand and what’s affordable/accessible. Soap sprays (not detergents!) used correctly are effective and safe enough for plants, and most importantly it’s safe for the home grower, their families/pets/etc.

The people that are dead set against soap without having a legitimate complaint against soap, they don’t know what they’re talking about and/or they’re trying to sell you something.

Sincerely,
A reformed elitist-plant-jerk

[tmoney]

haha, hey dimples! thanks for the in[ut, and i suppose i should probly look into some actual soaps intended for the purpose. perhaps there is a long term negative effect that i am not seeing, so it wouldn't jurt to try some of those things out!

i should also try some of that humility you speak of. i hear it does wonders! buuuut, until then i wiul continue to bully people into my way of thinking (because of course, i am right)

hopefully we will get some of the poo-pooers in here and they can try out some soap fueled non-humility.

until then, you like the meyers natural soap products for plants? or do you have a specific one you use besides that?

[Dimples]

I like the Ms. Meyer’s concentrate for general cleaning. We use 2-3 tablespoon per 32oz water in a spray bottle for counters, bathroom, etc.
Their hand soap and dish soap are great too and everything smells lovely (some scents are GROSS so give it a sniff at the store). I used to use Dr. Bs but our water is too hard and it reacts and leaves mad residue so we switched.

A drop or two of the dish soap is plenty for extra emulsification but when the fire ants are farming aphids on my cucumbers I just want them dead. Any damage done to the plants by the overly strong concentration will be worth it. Haha

[tmoney]

haha, yeah, i hate aphids as well. that is another infestation that couldn't be cured by our soap methods, but it was outside on some roses, and by the time we tried to spray it was waaaay too late. but sure enough, ma nature provided a couple lady bugs and in like 2 days we were aphid free (for awhile).

i will have to dig a little and see what plant insecticidal soaps we can get here in europe. i don't see ms. meyers available here, but thanks for the info!!

[Ray]

Soft-bodied insects may be controlled with soaps, because the waxy layers on them may be stripped away, and they desiccate to death.

Hard-shelled critters like some scales, will be unaffected. However, I suppose juveniles that have not yet grown that shell could be.

I think the debate about their efficacy may be more about the poor, incomplete treatment regimen most folks use, than the product used.

[Fuerte Rav]

Originally Posted by tmoney

haha, yeah, i hate aphids as well. that is another infestation that couldn't be cured by our soap methods, but it was outside on some roses, and by the time we tried to spray it was waaaay too late. but sure enough, ma nature provided a couple lady bugs and in like 2 days we were aphid free (for awhile).

i will have to dig a little and see what plant insecticidal soaps we can get here in europe. i don't see ms. meyers available here, but thanks for the info!!

I buy Pink Sun products online from UK, getting a bottle of Neem Oil and a bottle of Horticultural soap at the same time, however I haven't bought any since Brexit so not sure if still available in Europe.

[tmoney]

Originally Posted by Fuerte Rav

I buy Pink Sun products online from UK, getting a bottle of Neem Oil and a bottle of Horticultural soap at the same time, however I haven't bought any since Brexit so not sure if still available in Europe.

hey fuerta, thanks for the rec! just looked, and unfortunately no, they no longer ship to eu. oh well, the search continues!