Vandas: I feel like giving up

[Angurek]

I have a very hard time with this genus and its hybrids. I always find these plants to be very hard to grow and flower, and not very rewarding for the effort I put into them. I'll admit that I get jealous when I see tall, healthy vandas in pictures and books. I keep hearing that vandas are fast-growing and reliable plants, but I haven't seen this side of them. I'm embarrassed by the fact that I live in Florida and I can't grow vandaceous plants. I like the big, spectacular vandas, the ones that have huge blue and purple flowers and beautiful criscrossing foliage, but all I get out of them is disappointment.

I always start off with healthy plants that have may leaves and roots, but within six months, either the roots shrivel up or the plants decide to drop all their leaves and die. I also have a hard time getting them to bloom. I give them all the light in the world short of direct sunlight, but they seldom bloom. I also make sure they're well-watered and fed, but they grow, like, an eight of an inch a year. When my sanderiana was still alive, I got lucky one time and it put out a short spike with three flowers. After that, it never bloomed again, and it slowly declined until the cold front finished it off. My vasco lost all of its roots, and never put out any roots again. It, like the sanderiana, it weakend until the cold front put it out of its misery. Then there's the young Doctor Anek plant that I had for a while. It just faded away gradually until it turned into a lifeless collection of leaf stumps. As with the angraecoids, well, both of my late angraecums grew like weeds the first few months I had them, but then died suddenly, for no apparent reason (The roots stayed healthy, but the leaves turned brown at the axils and dropped off). The only vandaceous plant I have ever grown successfully is Rhynchostylis gigantea. At least that one made an attempt to stay alive for the time I had it.

Right now, I have a seedling that isn't really doing anything. I water it every day, I feed it during the growing season, and I make sure it gets good light, but it's growing very slowly. It hasn't put new roots out since January of last year, and it hasn't put out an apical leaf in eight months. At this rate, it won't be of blooming size for a very, very long time. While a part of me wants to try again with fresh plants, I'm this close to just giving up on them. These are very expensive plants, and I always end up finding that they aren't worth the money or the effort I invest in them.

If anybody has any suggestions on how to grow these plants, I'd appreciate them. I'd also appreciate any suggestions for hybrids and species that aren't going to die out within a few months.



Note: The plant in the picture is not mine. It would already be deader than yesterday's news if I even touched it.

[JennS]

When you say you are feeding it, what type of food are you using?

I would have to say that whomever told you vandas were fast growers had to be a bit confused. I have had pretty good luck with them, but I tend to feel that they are quite slow growers, especially in comparison with other orchids. However, some of them can still flower multiple times per year.

How do you water? I do it as early in the day as possible, but lately that has been closer to 10 or even noon. The earlier the better. I have mine hanging under a tree where they get dappled light and even a bit of direct morning light. If it is extremely hot, as it has been here lately (95 yesterday in Orlando), I might give them an evening shower too. I would do that around 5 or 6, even 7 if it is still really hot.

As for fertlizer you can give them food about twice a week, and adding something like superthrive would be beneficial. Also, when you water, you need to make sure the roots turn green, and they are getting fully hydrated. You can even come back and water the plants about 10 or 15 minutes later to make sure they get throughly watered.

My guess is that your plants were not getting thoroughly watered. When the roots shrivel up that is probably the case, unless there is some other disease or something.

If you have any pictures of your plants in poor health we can try to help diagnose from those.

[smweaver]

Hi, Carl. Jenn gave great advice in her comments to you. I would humbly add my opinion that your success might also depend on the type of vanda that you're trying to grow. The Euanthe (formerly Vanda) sanderiana hybrids tend, in my experience, to be the slower growing members of the family. They also tend to be some of the more temperamental ones as far as their flowering habits go (again, I'm only speaking from personal experience). Have you tried your hand at any vanda species other than sanderiana? After years of failing miserably at getting the sanderiana hybrids to grow (let alone flower), I tried a couple of the "true" vanda species. I started off with V. tessellata and V. merrillii and was overjoyed to find that they were much easier to grow and flower than the sanderiana-derived hybrids. They readily produce new roots along the entire length of the stem (unlike the sanderiana hybrids, which often limit their root growth to the base of the plant) and are quite vigorous growers. And while neither of these species probably has the "wow" factor that the big saucer-shaped flowers of the sanderiana plants display when they bloom, they do flower reliably and are easy (and relatively fast) growers. One of the nicest things about them (and in contrast to the vast majority of sanderiana hybrids) is that they produce wonderfully fragrant blooms. And if I can grow them here in the less-than-ideal Midwest, you shouldn't have too much trouble with them in Florida. You could also try growing some of the aerides species, which also produce fragrant blooms, and are easy to grow and flower. Not sure why all of the roots on your plans shriveled up and the leaves dropped, but maybe, as Jenn stated, they weren't getting watered heavily enough. During the growing season I drench mine with the hose a few times a day until every root has turned dark green with moisture and the entire plant looks like it just weathered a tropical downpour. Were you fertilizing your plants heavily? Although I have read that vandas are heavy feeders, I tend to be rather miserly with the fertilizer, and my plants still grow well and flower regularly. So I think that perhaps fertilizing them heavily might be a bit overrated (and if your plants are--or were--stressed and losing roots and leaves, fertilizing them may actually be more detrimental than beneficial). See if you can pick up a copy of Dr. Motes's book on vandas and their culture (can't remember the exact name, but it's probably on Amazon if you search under his name). It's got a lot of interesting information on the differences between sanderiana (and its hybrids) and the majority of the other vanda species, and it gives helpful information on how to grow the plants. And don't give up hope! Good luck!

Steve

[susiep]

Carl, you got some good advice from Steve and Jenn. I am in south Florida and I grow my vandas outside. I have some that are good bloomers and a few that never bloom. Vandas need to be left to do their own thing. Some take a long time to start blooming. My V. Cindy Banks was about 3 ft long before I saw the first spike. I grow mine under "solar" screen, but up very near the screen. Some can actually handle full sun but the leaves tend to burn and look ugly. The sun doesn't seem to bother the flowers though. The trick is to have lots of vandas. That way something is blooming! I grow almost all of mine on wires (no basket) and let the roots grow long. That way I can fit more in the shade house. When they send out spikes I move them to other areas of the house and patio so they can stretch out (and be enjoyed). Also I make little fertilizer tea bags out of cheesecloth and Dynamo time release fertilizer. I tie the bag to the top of the wire and as it gets wet the fertilizer drips on the plant and roots. I do this because I hardly ever fertilize (too lazy). I know they say vandas like lots of fertilizer, but mine bloom without any. So don't overdo the fertilizer, that will mess up roots for sure. The real important thing is lots of sun and water. Here are a few pics of mine.

[nenella]

Carl, don't give up!
Susie very nice plants & photos

[Angurek]

Thanks for the feedback, everyone. I've decided to try again, and take your advice. I'll be more sparing with the fertilizer this time around, and I'll be sure to drench my plants more than once a day. I guess I shouldn't be so quick to give up on the genus, but I was so frustrated that I didn't consider retrying.

Originally Posted by JennS

When you say you are feeding it, what type of food are you using?

I would have to say that whomever told you vandas were fast growers had to be a bit confused. I have had pretty good luck with them, but I tend to feel that they are quite slow growers, especially in comparison with other orchids. However, some of them can still flower multiple times per year.

How do you water? I do it as early in the day as possible, but lately that has been closer to 10 or even noon. The earlier the better. I have mine hanging under a tree where they get dappled light and even a bit of direct morning light. If it is extremely hot, as it has been here lately (95 yesterday in Orlando), I might give them an evening shower too. I would do that around 5 or 6, even 7 if it is still really hot.

As for fertlizer you can give them food about twice a week, and adding something like superthrive would be beneficial. Also, when you water, you need to make sure the roots turn green, and they are getting fully hydrated. You can even come back and water the plants about 10 or 15 minutes later to make sure they get throughly watered.

My guess is that your plants were not getting thoroughly watered. When the roots shrivel up that is probably the case, unless there is some other disease or something.

If you have any pictures of your plants in poor health we can try to help diagnose from those.

I don't have a digital camera or a scanner, so I can't post pictures of the plants in question. To describe them, though, they were all reduced to brown, lifeless stems topped with three or four leaves, looking almost like palm trees. The roots shriveled up and refused to take in water until they turned brown and dessicated completely. The few leaves that remained at the top rotted off the plant and eventually fell off (same thing happened to my angraecums). I fed the vandas with 20-20-20 water-soluble fertilizer each week during the growing season, and drenched them until they were soaking wet in my bathtub.

However, even though I watered them daily, I wasn't watering them more than once per day like you do. I'll be sure to give them more drinks during hot days next time, and I'll try to get my hands on some superthrive.

Originally Posted by smweaver

Hi, Carl. Jenn gave great advice in her comments to you. I would humbly add my opinion that your success might also depend on the type of vanda that you're trying to grow. The Euanthe (formerly Vanda) sanderiana hybrids tend, in my experience, to be the slower growing members of the family. They also tend to be some of the more temperamental ones as far as their flowering habits go (again, I'm only speaking from personal experience). Have you tried your hand at any vanda species other than sanderiana? After years of failing miserably at getting the sanderiana hybrids to grow (let alone flower), I tried a couple of the "true" vanda species. I started off with V. tessellata and V. merrillii and was overjoyed to find that they were much easier to grow and flower than the sanderiana-derived hybrids. They readily produce new roots along the entire length of the stem (unlike the sanderiana hybrids, which often limit their root growth to the base of the plant) and are quite vigorous growers. And while neither of these species probably has the "wow" factor that the big saucer-shaped flowers of the sanderiana plants display when they bloom, they do flower reliably and are easy (and relatively fast) growers. One of the nicest things about them (and in contrast to the vast majority of sanderiana hybrids) is that they produce wonderfully fragrant blooms. And if I can grow them here in the less-than-ideal Midwest, you shouldn't have too much trouble with them in Florida. You could also try growing some of the aerides species, which also produce fragrant blooms, and are easy to grow and flower. Not sure why all of the roots on your plans shriveled up and the leaves dropped, but maybe, as Jenn stated, they weren't getting watered heavily enough. During the growing season I drench mine with the hose a few times a day until every root has turned dark green with moisture and the entire plant looks like it just weathered a tropical downpour. Were you fertilizing your plants heavily? Although I have read that vandas are heavy feeders, I tend to be rather miserly with the fertilizer, and my plants still grow well and flower regularly. So I think that perhaps fertilizing them heavily might be a bit overrated (and if your plants are--or were--stressed and losing roots and leaves, fertilizing them may actually be more detrimental than beneficial). See if you can pick up a copy of Dr. Motes's book on vandas and their culture (can't remember the exact name, but it's probably on Amazon if you search under his name). It's got a lot of interesting information on the differences between sanderiana (and its hybrids) and the majority of the other vanda species, and it gives helpful information on how to grow the plants. And don't give up hope! Good luck!

Steve

Thanks, Steve. I haven't tried any of the vanda species, or any of the aerides. I took a look at the species you referred to, and they all look very nice. Some of the ones that caught my attention were V. denisonia, V. brunnea, V. merrillii, V. luzonica, and V. tricolor. I'm also considering V. coerulea, but I'm not sure if it would be well-adapted to my area because it's a cool grower.

I'll also give aerides a try. One of the local growers has a bunch of them in his greenhouse, and they look very nice.

By any chance, do you know any growers that sell V. merrillii? I looked everywhere but haven't been able to find them.

Originally Posted by susiep

Carl, you got some good advice from Steve and Jenn. I am in south Florida and I grow my vandas outside. I have some that are good bloomers and a few that never bloom. Vandas need to be left to do their own thing. Some take a long time to start blooming. My V. Cindy Banks was about 3 ft long before I saw the first spike. I grow mine under "solar" screen, but up very near the screen. Some can actually handle full sun but the leaves tend to burn and look ugly. The sun doesn't seem to bother the flowers though. The trick is to have lots of vandas. That way something is blooming! I grow almost all of mine on wires (no basket) and let the roots grow long. That way I can fit more in the shade house. When they send out spikes I move them to other areas of the house and patio so they can stretch out (and be enjoyed). Also I make little fertilizer tea bags out of cheesecloth and Dynamo time release fertilizer. I tie the bag to the top of the wire and as it gets wet the fertilizer drips on the plant and roots. I do this because I hardly ever fertilize (too lazy). I know they say vandas like lots of fertilizer, but mine bloom without any. So don't overdo the fertilizer, that will mess up roots for sure. The real important thing is lots of sun and water. Here are a few pics of mine.

Hi, Susan. I really like that cheesecloth method - I think I'll give it a shot with my new plants. It sure sounds better than having to dissolve the granules in water and then pour the mixture over the plants. If your plants got so big and bloomed so much with the method, it is definitely effective. A bunch of plants just made it onto my wish list, so I'm probably gonna have plenty of vandaceous plants to enjoy eventually (I just hope I can save up enough money to pay for them all).

Your plants look absolutely stunning. That whitish-looking one looks a bit like a tricolor, and I love the bright orange color on the second one. Lots of roots on that third plant! Has it tried to attach itself to your walls?

[natasha]

i had my first vanda about a year ago when i started this hobby. my dens have flowered plenty of times - i have about 20 of them yet my vandas are doing nothing. i keep buying more - i think i have about 40? anyway, to cut the story short, my initial vandas are now in flower or sending spikes - 4 plants, after 1 year waiting!

i have them in full sun, watered once daily, none if it rains too heavily. i spray with foliar and flowering fertilizer about twice a week if i remember and put sheep manure pellet about twice a month. i have them in plastic pots with charcoal. some had spagnum or wood shaving mixed in too...

i hope you didn't give up yet, just try to keep your vandas alive first! i killed maybe a couple too

[rathwulf]

Hey, never give up! One of my first orchids was a hybrid vanda, I live in Mexico City and the climate here is horrendous for a vanda so instead of forcing the poor plant to grow I forced adapt myself I bought a humidifier. lol And now I know how to grow my babies I even have teretes and they seem happy and growing fast. You just need to know their where's and hows. In this month issue of orchids there's a article about vandas.

Also there is a silent killed of plants, chemicals in the home day cleaning, sometimes that window polish might drop on a plant, and it is enough to kill it. I had a Phal Stuartiana in my bathroom and I almost fainted when it died then I noticed my housekeeping lady was wild with spray and I almost go ballistic on her...anyhow...she was ignorant of it...*grips*

Here is a picture of my Vanda Coerulea x Dr. Anek in bloom, now its potted, but I battled a lot with her until she settled.

Dont lose confidence! You can do it!

[gixrj18]

If your Vandas are dropping leaves and dieing, that sounds like fungus. I would suggest more airflow, a monthly fungicide schedule, lots of light, lots of water, and weekly fertilizer. Also, no matter how much you fertilize, if your ph isn't right (or at least close), your plants may not even be uptaking the nutrients....something to keep in mind.

[Grandma M]

Carl, try Ascocenda Princess Mikasa (A. Royal Sapphire X V.coerulea) the pink or the blue variety. I find they are easy to grow and are good bloomers.

Marilyn