V. NOID Flower deformity

[JennS]

I received a couple vandas back in early August from my grandmother who decided she would kill them on accident. Of course, I happily took them in!

Well, one of the two is a blue type, looks like it has some coerulea parentage. It was blooming back in July when she got it. Now, it is blooming again.

Problem is, the flowers are about half the size as the previous time, and they are a bit spotty. Here is the brief history of it's life since it last bloomed...

- Very little care/water/light from July to August until in my care.
- Began regular waterings, feedings, regular light in early August once in my care
- Also began getting Superthrive which it may or may not have been getting before July
- Flower spike emerged about a month and half ago
- Spike grew extra long and twisted back around so the spike is longer then any vanda spike I have ever had
- When spike was about 1 inch long treated with Malathion to resist Thrip infestation
- Last week, had to be inside for 3 days (still got pretty decent light, but reduced watering) due to cold
- Been exposed to a few nights below 65 degrees
- Late afternoon treatment with Physan 20 over the weekend

So, which of these things, if any do you think coudl have caused this? I am assuming it was my silly late afternoon application of the Physan which caused the spotting. It is a light brownish color that appeard on the outside of the buds the day after treating, so I think it must be related. Now that the buds have opened is it visible on the inside of the flowers on some of them, but not all.

Also, the flowers just opened in the past couple days. I have noticed that alot of my larger flower size vandas still continue to increase in flower size after the bud opens (ie. the flower keeps growing even though it is open already). So, that might be that they are still growing some, but I can't imagine them doubling in size which is what they need to do to reach their last bloom size.

Lastly, do you think the super long spike could have caused or been part of the cause of the smaller flowers?

I will take some pics tonight...but any speculations based on the above are welcome! Thanks.

[JennS]

Ok, here are the pics. I took them yesterday.

I know the plant is still very pretty, and I am not complaining, but I just want to prevent causing this in the future.

It also seemed very strange to me that the flowers opened so quickly. Generally it is a flower or two per day, this one did 3 flowers each day or maybe even 4 in one day.... Peculiar....

[JennS]

Pic 2 and 3 show how the last bud curved backward on itself....


Pic 6 shows some spotting. The others just show the deformed flowers.

[dgenovese1]

Jenn,

Based on your description, here is what I think.
First, your thought that the flowers may just not be mature enough is great thinking. Some Vanda flowers do not reach their full size for up to two weeks after they first open.

I don't think that the long spike should affect how large the flowers get...but watering conditions can and will. Maybe the few days it got less water was at the perfectly wrong time.

The way you describe the twisted spike tells me that maybe...just maybe…some thrips damage may have occurred when the spike was younger.

Vandas can tolerate temps down to 50 without incident, and even cooler than that for short periods. Temps down to 65 will not harm them.

That's what I have for you. I hope it helps.

[JennS]

Here are two more pics to show the extra long spike, and the very beginning of it's growth.

[JennS]

Originally Posted by dgenovese1

Jenn,

Based on your description, here is what I think.
First, your thought that the flowers may just not be mature enough is great thinking. Some Vanda flowers do not reach their full size for up to two weeks after they first open.

I don't think that the long spike should affect how large the flowers get...but watering conditions can and will. Maybe the few days it got less water was at the perfectly wrong time.

The way you describe the twisted spike tells me that maybe...just maybe…some thrips damage may have occurred when the spike was younger.

Vandas can tolerate temps down to 50 without incident, and even cooler than that for short periods. Temps down to 65 will not harm them.

That's what I have for you. I hope it helps.

It does help. Thanks David.

What about the spotting, any thoughts on that? Possible the late afternoon/early evening Physan application? Darn Caipirinhas...I had a couple of those then decided I needed to play with my plants! I guess that is what I get!

I did mist them really heavy while they were inside, but I guess it just wasn't enough?

[JennS]

I did do a malathion treatment too when the spike showed up, but maybe it wasn't soon enough? What is the best time to do this? And how often?

[gixrj18]

I'm not sure about the deformity....I don't use malathion, so I don't know, but some insecticides will do considerable damage to blooms. As for the noid, this Vanda looks to have a lot of V. coerulea in it. The color, the form, the tesselations, and the way the lateral petals turn slightly upwards.

[JennS]

Originally Posted by gixrj18

I'm not sure about the deformity....I don't use malathion, so I don't know, but some insecticides will do considerable damage to blooms. As for the noid, this Vanda looks to have a lot of V. coerulea in it. The color, the form, the tesselations, and the way the lateral petals turn slightly upwards.

Thanks Jasen. I agree, it definitely looks to have some V. coerulea in it!

[dgenovese1]

Hi Jenn,

The spots may have to do with thrips damage...or the insecticides you used. Not as much with the Physan as the Malathion (sp?).

I am very careful with Malathion, and have never used it on Vandas or Phals. I've been told that in the heat it can fry the thin leaves of the Vandas, and in general make the leaves on Phals deformed. I'm not sure of the effect of either on bloom/spike production; however I have been told that the only safe insecticide for blooms is Orthene. Whether there are others or not, I don't know for sure, but that's what I've been told, and it is what I stick to when spraying blooms/spikes, even though it smells bad...at least I can preserve the blooms with it.