replicating the "cloud" forest while accepting the limitations of my technology

[DirtyCoconuts]

So this thread is about two things; increasing my understanding of how cloud forests "breath" and rain, and; figuring out how to achieve that in a terrarium with some limitations on my technology

first- i understand generally that the temperature in a cloud forest is often widely varied but that the constant is a drop in temp at night that causes a dramatic increase in humidity to precipitate and make it colder (sort of, from watching NatGeo and such)

I am hoping that in my house (72F) using an enclosed 10 gal tank, and running an ultrasonic mister for some period along with a running water element i can create a false drop in temp at night - but how


second. based on thermodynamic, the mister needs to be at the top of the tank, this required a pump to make a res at the top of the tank which will also feed the water fall effect- the limit is that the mister cannot run WITHOUT the water - i can run water with no mist but not the opposite.

i have a 150w full spectrum led that is adjustable and i suspect i will be also masking the roof to further reduce light and at least mottle it

so what photo and mist period might be the most successful?

i was thinking that i run the light 14/10 the water fall 24/0 and the mister right when the lights go off for 20-30 minutes and then for 2-4 hours before the "dawn"

hope being that the light will be adding SOME heat and that will make the cycle work


i don't know if is it relevant but this will be a bioactive tank with a false bottom to reduce my maintenance long term


i have chosen Ecuadorian and peruvian species from 1000-2500 m (kind of a big range I know LOL) but i hope they all will be able to hang....the tank will have a LOT of moisture which i hope will also cool it


thanks

[Ray]

I thought the unique identifier of a cloud forest was that it was cloudy (blanketed in mist) pretty much all the time...

[DirtyCoconuts]

well that is easily achievable...just run the mister and waterfall all day.

i could very easily be confused about my nighttime temps. that was my understanding but from less than scientific sources

[Ray]

Well... cloud forests do tend to be at elevated altitudes, so that would naturally lead to significant day/night changes, I suppose.

[estación seca]

Cloud forests occur in mountains. There are two mechanisms for the cloud/fog formation, either or both of which may be active.

Warm, moist air moving towards the mountains rises when it hits them. The adiabatic cooling causes moisture to precipitate out as clouds, and the vegetation in the zone where this happens is the cloud forest.

As night falls and temperatures fall, humid air has the moisture condense out to form fog/clouds.

In some areas the fog/clouds burn off in late afternoon, other times not. During sunny spells it can be quite hot. But when it's foggy it's quite cool, like a California beach during June gloom. Or San Franscisco in July.

Edit: The most true-to-nature way for somebody in southeast Florida to replicate this would be to draw hot, humid air from outside through a chamber full of ice into the terrarium. An ultrasonic humidifier will just humidify the terrarium, not cool it, unless the air is very dry to start.

[hypostatic]

Something to note is that if the viv is "closed" a lot of the heat from the lights gets trapped in. But if you have some vents and fans, you've created a nice setup for evaporative cooling, along with the ultrasonic fogger.

[DirtyCoconuts]

I have the top two inches of the front panel with 48x (1/4”) holes. That should work out to a 3” hole which i calculated (guessed) would be enough.

I was thinking about if I needed a fan...

[rbarata]

Cloud forest conditions are the most difficult to achieve. There must be a delicate balance between temp, HR and air flow. I don't have objective data to support it but I have the impression that most of the people growing a setup like the one required, sooner or later face issues related with the above-mentioned balance.
Anyway, we all face problems when growing orchids so you shouldn't stop from trying.

[DirtyCoconuts]

When stubbornness meets a problem....giving up is rarely the result

I appreciate the advice and comments. Any problems I can solve before they start will be the best ones LOL

[wisdomseeker]

Works for me