Questions about s/h

[Azhael]

Hi, i´m new here, but i´ve been reading and learning for a while. I still have a few questions though, and i was hoping you could help me.
A couple years ago i was given an orchid, which eventually died due to bad care :S The thing is, since, my father has developed a liking for these plants and now owns a Phalaenopsis, a Dendrobium and an Oncidium (i don´t know the exact species).
He has had the Phal blooming a few times, the Dendrobium started spiking and then it died off, and the Oncidium bloomed this year for the first time, but the bloom lasted very short.
In spite of the small success, the plants were kept on soil and were heavily watered(against my repeated advice), so the roots rot.
I changed them all to LECA a couple weeks ago, and during the transplant, i saw the Phal had still some healthy roots but most of them were rotten. The Dend had suffered a lot, only one stem surviving, and creating keikis like crazy. All the roots looked very bad. The Onc. has pretty dried bulbs and just a few healthy roots.
My question is, can they survive with such a horrible state of the roots??? I´m confident with the Phal, because it looks very good and it has new root growth, but the other two look pretty bad. I was hoping S/H would be their salvation but now i´m not sure i did the right thing, is S/H the good choice for these?
Also, we took two keikis off the Dend, and potted them on LECA too. They seem fine, at least they are not dying, but there seems to be no growth at all. I´m guessing i just need to be patient, but when should i start to worry?
Excuse my english and the long post

[Lene Th.]

Originally Posted by Azhael

I was hoping S/H would be their salvation but now i´m not sure i did the right thing, is S/H the good choice for these?

Im no expert on either of those chids, but i do have both, and i grow them both in S/H.
After a adjustment-period they both seems to like this culture. The Oncidium is growing two spikes, and the Dend. has just now started to grow new and more roots, after only one a half week in S/H...
The Phals seems to like the S/H culture as well.

The point is, thoug, they both had new growing roots at the time of the repot. S/H can surly be a salvation for the chids, as for mine witch was salvated from my heavy watering...
But its no miracle-cure to a dying chid, its a different way of culture, simple as that.
A chid without roots, needs to grow roots before a change, or at least have some new, active growing.

I would suggest to put a bag over the hole pot and chid, taking it out of bright light and keep it warm. Theres different ways of doing this (Sphag and bag-method), i have most sucsess with just putting a bag over the hole thing, cut a small hole in the top, and keep it open in the bottom. This is to encrease humidity around the leafs, but allow some air-sirculation. And then let it be, and hope it will pull thru.

Hopefully some other, more knowleble growers will chime in here.

[dgenovese1]

Hi Azhael,
I don't know what S/H is, but it may be possible to salvage the dendrobium and oncidium.
You may want to just pot up the keikis you mentioned that were growing from the dendrobium. If all the plants mature roots are dead, this would be your best alternative. Just treat them like you would any other small dendrobium. I grow mine in a mixture of half charcoal and half lava rock. Perhaps there are similar if not the same growing medium available in Spain. Just make sure you don't over pot them (dendrobs don't like a lot of extra space in their pots), and secure them well so that they don't move in the pot while they are forming new roots.
I think that Lene's advice about using the Sphag and bag-method for the oncidium would work well. My only addition would be to make sure that all the rot on the roots is completely removed and treated, and then let the plant dry well before placing it in the sphag and bag. This could aid in forcing it to produce new, healthy roots.

[Azhael]

Thank you for your replies. The Oncidium only has a few new air roots, so i think i´ll try the sphag´n´bag method, though i don´t think i have a clear bag big enough Ô_o
One of the bulbs has dried out and become yellow, but it was an old one so i suposse it´s normal with the change and all. I read i should expect some leaves to fall even from the new and healthier bulbs, is this right?
The Phal is looking good, i think it just requires a lot of patience until it gets adjusted. The Dend, well, i´m counting on the keikis now, because the mother plant is probably going to die.

About the sphang ´n´bag....is it absolutely necessary that the leaves remain in their original position or can i move them and put them up to fit them in a not so loose bag?
Thank you for your patience and time.

[Ray]

When you change the root zone environment - upon repotting, for example - the plant must grow new roots that are tailored to that new environment. Most post-transplant losses occur because the plant is too weak to survive while it recovers its root system - moisture loss is one of the more significant dangers, as the plant does not have the good roots to replace what's lost through the vegetation.

By keeping the plant shady, warm, and VERY humid, you reduce the outside stresses on it and give it the best chance to recover.


You can move the leaves, as long as you don't break them...

[Lene Th.]

If i where you, i would read up on S/H culture on Rays side, its sticky on top of this forum. He has alsow got good explenations on the Sphag and Bag-method.

All i really can tell you, is that all of mine chids, including Phals, Oncidium and a Dendro, have adapted to the culture with minor adjustments. The Dendro lost some leafs, the Oncidium stopped growing for some weeks, and one of the Phals got some root-rot befor it adjusted. All of this is normal.

I would encrease the humidity with a bag, take it out of brigth light to make it throw the energy into growing roots, and use a fan to encrease air-sirculation. And flush water tru the pots several times a week to flush out the rooten, old roots. Humidity and air-sirculation is important in the adjustment-fase, acording to my experience...
But, im just a newbee.... Read up on Rays site!

Edit, Ray beat me to it!

[Azhael]

Thank you both for answering. I placed the plant in a bag and sealed it to the pot and made a few small holes on the top. It´s in a shady area but still receives good light.
I´ll follow your advice, but i´m concerned about watering....i don´t want the few healthy roots(very few) to rot too. Plus, aren´t oncidiums supossed to like getting fairly dry? If i flush it twice a week, it won´t get dry.....
Another question, how small a pot do Dendrobium keikis need?
Excuse all the answers, please bare with my newbieness

[Ray]

Oncids don't necessarily have to get dry - I grow them in semi-hydroponics, and they do quite well. Air flow to the roots is key. Read this: Air Management

[Azhael]

Thank you very much Ray. I had missed that particular article.

A little update...The Phal. is growing new roots and is looking great. It may be growing a new spike too.
The Dend. has stopped losing leaves and now seems quite stable, which is very good.
The Onc. also stopped losing leaves, but i guess it will need a looong time to recover, providing it ever does.
Thank you again for your patience and advices, i hope i don´t kill them :P

[Azhael]

The Oncidium has a new groth!!!
If i´m not mistaken this means as the new bulb grows new roots will develop, right??? Which means the plant has a chance to create a new root system

My concern now is wether i should take it out of the bag or not...should i wait until new roots are formed or is it save to say the new bulb is enough??

By the way, i lost one of the Dend. keikis....and the other one is not looking too promising.....bummer.