Learn to say (or type) it right!

[RosieC]

It's good to have a reminder of the correct way to name orchids. I sometimes get confused when a name is written incorrectly about what it actually is.

I fully agree with those who say vendors often get them wrong and they are just copying the tag though... I've had so many I've seen wrong, even wrong spellings of names (such as "Baldwins Kaleidoscope" instead of "Baldan's", I queried the vendor on that one and they said that's what their European wholesaler had tagged it).

I'm a stickler for names so like to check them when I get them, but not everyone wants to go to that effort and it's easy to assume your vendor has got it right.

[katrina]

The English language can be a little bit different depending on whether you're from England, Australia, Canada, or America. We may all speak the same language...but we don't always speak the same language. If you get my meaning.

In a perfect world we would all use perfect grammar, punctuation, etc., and while I do my best...I know I make mistakes sometimes. Humans = mistakes happen...just the way it is. [I'm sure there are errors in there somewhere.]

Althooooooooough....it would be nice if people could use punctuation. Even if it's a little bit off....

i say this because those groups of words that run on and on and on and on and on and on as if the person never breaths but rather just keeps talking for hours and hours or maybe even day or months or years with no end in sight tends to get very hard to read and quite frankly i tend to skip over it because it makes my eyes cross and gives me a headache and if i keep reading it im afraid my eyes might start to bleed worse yet is when that damned smart phone spell check gets involved and turns what youre trying to type into something radically different

I can't do it as well as I had hoped but I think you get the idea.



With all of that said...this is not a grammar forum but rather an orchid forum. And, because we are all here for the orchid part...I think the main priority should be proper nomenclature. The rules in that area are the same...no matter what country you're from or what language you speak. The rest of the corrections would be icing in the cake.

FWIW that's my

[Orquiadicto]

In my opinion, even if this is an orchid forum, the most elemental grammar rules should be followed. I think it's just respect for your reader if you you make it as clear as possible. I often edit my posts when I see I have misspelled a word, or if I haven't written a capital when I should have. I believe it makes understanding an idea or an opinion easier when punctuations rules are respected.

[WhiteRabbit]

I think more than enough has been said regarding grammar, etc - this thread is in "Scientific Matters" forum

[AnonYMouse]

Can just Ray's first post be made into a sticky? Possibly in a couple more places (Beginner's and ID forums). An easily accessed place for reference.

I think I'm good on Genus species but not regarding hybrids and cultivars.

---------- Post added at 12:23 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:14 PM ----------

Additionally, it should be locked.

[tropterrarium]

Originally Posted by cbuchman

I have even seen incorrect genus abbreviations from vendors. (e.g., the abbreviation for Encyclia is E. not Enc. which is the abbreviation for Encheiridion)

While I fully agree with the overall direction of the thread, I have to take an exception with the above. The cited examples may be customary abbreviations, but certainly in scientific writing, the abbreviation used is context dependent. When there is only a single E-genus in an article/paper, then the genus is abbreviated "E." If there is more than one E-genus, then multi-letter abbreviations are used, two-, three-, four-letter depending on context. Please also note that the genus is not abbreviated if it is the first word in a sentence. One of my pet-peeves as an editor.

The abbreviation mania in botany baffles me. A genus should always be written out in full before it is abbreviated. Many vendor list are close to unreadable for a novice for sure, but also in areas one is not familiar with. Folks, there are some 800–900 orchid genera! And with authorities, what is gained from Hook. vs. Hooker? Just makes literature searches more cumbersome. Oh well, when in Rome ...

[WaterWitchin]

Uggghhhh. WaterWitchin could tweak and re-tweak 'til blue in the face. Puttin' it out there, instead....

Wowza. I'm gonna throw in my moderators, just because this thread disturbs me. Enough I come back again, and again, and again. Bite my tongue, and dismiss. Finally, Cannot.Shut.Up.

‘tis good this was posted in Scientific Matters category. Would be even better, had it been posted in the Advanced Discussion category, where it also states “Newbies Beware” or similar verbiage.
Please, don’t put this out as a sticky “as is,” as was suggested.

WaterWitchin is a moderator on a couple of forums (not related to orchids) and has spent many a year being a scopist, proofreader, and editor, amongst other hats. In the meantime, when not being paid or writing for a particular reason or venue, there’s a hella lot of colloquialism and chuckle in my words… just because of the way I roll.

I would most heartily agree there is a time/place for perfect punctuation, grammar, capitalization, and most importantly citation… Depending on the venue. Well, there should always at least be enough punctuation to figure out what someone is saying. But maybe that’s just my lack of attention span.

It took me numerous years to be brave enough to post on the OB. Finally decided, in for a penny, in for a chuckle. I will never, EVER, have the type of experience raising orchids and caring about them in the way some are inclined. Too many interests, too little time. Also know there are many who would give a whit about many things I find to be a passion, for me.

There is much to be learned if one cares to learn such, from others. Likely, ‘tis the way it was originally couched. To me, this smacks of dogma that’s overrun karma. And perhaps a bad day with not enough filter. Been there. Done it. Have several holey T-shirts.

What brought me to this board was the constant of folks who are learning, who are wise, who have experience, who do not and ask most excellent questions never before considered by me. Good Golly…even the differences of opinion on the same.darned.problem. Never know when it will work for ya… depending on one’s particular micro-climate.

Having blathered on more than long enough, methinks enough. Gracias, to all who care to raise any type of plant.

[PaphMadMan]

Originally Posted by tropterrarium

While I fully agree with the overall direction of the thread, I have to take an exception with the above. The cited examples may be customary abbreviations, but certainly in scientific writing, the abbreviation used is context dependent. When there is only a single E-genus in an article/paper, then the genus is abbreviated "E." If there is more than one E-genus, then multi-letter abbreviations are used, two-, three-, four-letter depending on context. Please also note that the genus is not abbreviated if it is the first word in a sentence. One of my pet-peeves as an editor.

The abbreviation mania in botany baffles me. A genus should always be written out in full before it is abbreviated. Many vendor list are close to unreadable for a novice for sure, but also in areas one is not familiar with. Folks, there are some 800–900 orchid genera! And with authorities, what is gained from Hook. vs. Hooker? Just makes literature searches more cumbersome. Oh well, when in Rome ...

Now, I must take exception. For all registered orchid hybrids, and all natural genera contributing to any registered hybrid, there are official (not customary) abbreviations for every genus. They are official in exactly the same way that registered orchid hybrid names are official, as they are designated by the International Orchid Register as part of the registration process.

In formal or informal scientific writing about orchids, when no hybrids are under discussion, the scientific convention of spelling out the genus once and subsequently using a single letter abbreviation as long as there can be no confusion is appropriate. When communicating about the horticultural practices of orchid growing, especially if any hybrids are mentioned, the official genus abbreviations should be used as part of any complete name. Using the full genus name is acceptable, but there is no need to ever write out a genus in full if the official abbreviation is used. This is as much a part of standard horticultural nomenclature for orchids as anything Ray mentioned in his original post.

And now... Many thanks to Ray for the post that started this thread. I've been very close to posting something similar myself, though I doubt I could have been as diplomatic as Ray.

[Fairorchids]

A large part of the problem comes from incorrect, sloppy and in rare cases, perhaps even intentionally misleading labels from vendors. I know one or two personally, who are just horrible spellers, but otherwise great orchid people.

I have been known to send corrections (both on Orchid Mall and Ebay), but with few results. Other than correcting the labels in my own collection, what else can one do?

Should we try to shame them with a 'laughing stock' thread?

[The Orchid Boy]

Totally agree, people need to care about their grammar in speech and writing, if you know orchids you should also educate yourself on the correct abbreviations, ect.

I'm a teenager but I love English, grammar, and spelling in school so I'm constantly correcting my family. Especially with these words: it's, its, good, well, bad, badly, real, really, there, their, & I could go on and on. I sometimes want to correct the news anchors too.