Safe rooting product for orchids using IBA and NAA?

[PaphLover]

Hi Experts,

I found this product at the hydroponic store I go to because it has the cheapest prices for LECA, lights, fertilizer, net pots, etc. They sell quite a bit to our orchid society.

Admittedly, I know nothing about growing pot plants, but I suspect they're less particular about fertilizer overload than orchids, so I don't think products used on them can just be interchanged and used on orchids.

But I found this product and wanted to try it out because:
1. you get a lot of rooting gel for the cost.
2. I'm leery of buying keiki paste off of eBay
3. I thought it might be useful for rootless plants you're trying to save or seedlings just out of flask.
4. The manufacturer is within a 15min drive of me. I like supporting local.

I've looked for a more complete listing of ingredients, but the list below is the best I could find. So, based on this limited information...

My questions:
1. Do you think this product would be safe for orchids?
2. Do you think it would cause deformity either in the plant, future bloom development, cell structure?
3. Would you buy this product?
4. If I contact the manufacturer directly to inquire about ingredients are they required to give more information than "our secret recipe nonsense" written below? Is there any specific ingredients I should be asking about? Ratios? Basically, what info should I ask them for?

Ray, I'm definitely hoping you'll chime in on this one, since I have read your article on the use of IBA and NAA in root production.

Thanks for reading and your input!



Remo’s Roots is Remo’s original and flagship product. This unique formula seals your cut immediately and saturates the area with multiple rooting compounds.

It is one of the only propagation gels to contain two different rooting hormones: IBA and NAA. Normally these two hormones repel each other and thus won’t bind together in a gel format. Our proprietary mixing method successfully binds the two together for maximum rooting potential.

Remo’s Roots is registered with the Canadian Food Inspection Agency (CFIA)

Remo Guarantee:

Remo Nutrients are a blend of organic and synthetic base ingredients
Our full product line is 100% vegan
We use a mixture of only pharmaceutical grade ingredients of the highest quality
Products are pH balanced to make mixing easier
We use reverse osmosis water
All products have a 5 year shelf life as long as it is kept room temperature and not frozen
All products can be used indoors or outdoors
All products are filtered so they can be used safely in hydroponic systems, as well as any other grow medium
Each batch of our nutrients undergoes strict and consistent quality control standards
We never use cheap chlorides or carbonates such as Muriate of Potash and calcium carbonate

[estación seca]

I don't know Canadian labeling laws.

I won't buy secret formulas because they might contain nothing at all.

You don't need two rooting hormones. One works fine.

Rooting gels have excessive concentrations of hormones for most plant seedlings. Orchid seedlings are even more tender, so I wouldn't take the risk unless I wanted to see whether it harmed them.

[Ray]

There is nothing wrong with multiple rooting hormones. Dyna-Gro KLN has both NAA and IBA. Sometimes plants will react differently to different auxins. Oh, and if I am not mistaken, KelpMax has a dozen or so....

Questions I would ask are how much of each is in the formula, and how old is that particular bottle. The synthetic hormones are notoriously chemically unstable, and degrade pretty rapidly. I really question their 5-year claim.

One further concern I have, based upon their description, is the "seals the cut immediately" thing. As that product is obviously made with folks taking cuttings in mind, where that is important, I wonder what it would do to exposed orchid tissue, where you are not trying to "seal" anything, as that discourages growth.

[PaphMadMan]

I'm going to have to disagree with Ray on the stability of artificial hormones. We may have even had this disagreement before. From my time working in plant tissue culture, NAA was always the first choice for long term activity in media. It holds up to autoclaving, and is still active in diverse formulas of prepared sterile media months after preparation under good storage conditions. It also can be stored for years in original containers under good conditions.

IAA, the most common natural auxin, was specifically chosen when decreasing activity in media over time was desired. And it is degraded during media preparation by pH, chemical exposure, autoclaving etc. so had to be added as a final step in making media. IBA is intermediate between NAA and IAA.

From horticulture classes, the general recommendation was also that NAA was the more stable form in commercial rooting products.

Pot growing drives demand and pricing for many horticultural products, and anything that is aimed at that market but isn't effective and competitive just wouldn't be around for long. And it will probably have high turnover rate in stores so will be fresher than products aimed at other markets and sold in big box garden centers. That line about NAA and IBA repelling each other is utter bullshit though. I would usually see cannabis products as good choices if they met the needs of my plants but that alone would make me hesitate on this one.

The key to this decision is if it meet the needs for the intended use. Products intended for use on orchids are usually in paste form so they stay in place for an extended period of time, due to orchids' slow response and lower effective hormone levels than something like cannabis. Personally, I do get my keiki paste on eBay.

[Ray]

You might be dead on, PMM.

My info came from Dave Neal, owner of Dyna-Gro, producer of KLN. I think some of the discrepancy in our understanding is based upon the form of the chemicals in the various products.

The synthetic hormones are not very water soluble, so are "mineralized" - made into soluble salts - to enhance that. It may be that the particular salts I'm familiar with are less stable than the hormones themselves.

[PaphLover]

Thank you for your informative responses!

PaphMadMan,
"That line about NAA and IBA repelling each other is utter bullshit though." ...My BS meter was going off also when I read that.

Ray,
I take your point about "sealing" orchid tissue, which is, as you stated, counterproductive to the goal: root growth.

Hmmmm, it seems the consensus is that I'd be better off with other products.

I'll have to ask the store I go to if they can get KLN. They do stock other Dyna-Gro products. Perhaps it's a possibility. They did bring in windowsill heat mats for me.