Amazon vendor "Exotic Plants"

[inombrable]

Originally Posted by MCSchrum

Thanks inombrable. Kumpol on Ebay is where I bought the seeds that I currently have. I have read good things about that vendor. They have some really neat species, but not a huge selection of seeds. I guess I'll start asking around on the forum for other species that folks might be pollenating.

Nice to hear that, which ones you got form kumpol? it would be interesting to exchange info on our results if we got the same seeds. I have from him Bulb. dentiferum, cymbidium lowianun and tracyanum. As well as dendrobium signatum. Sown on november 20th they seem to be growing but still no PLB yet besides signatum.

[MCSchrum]

Those species look really cool. I ordered Ascocentrum pusilum and Dendrobium christyanum, and they have me Dendrobium stuposum for free. We should both post pictures 4-5 years from now when we get flowers!!!!

[Amanda L]

Originally Posted by MCSchrum

Amanda L, I realize that orchids are difficult to grow from seed. But I'd like to give it a shot. I just finished building a glove box, which I believe is pretty close to air tight. I've got some mother flasks made up as well. I have some orchid seed which I purchased from a reliable vendor, but I was looking for other sources so that I can expand the variety of species I can work with.

I realized that you were looking specifically seeds after I posted my rant. LOL

I would still check out the Vendor Feedback section and see if any of the recommended ones offer seeds

---------- Post added at 09:18 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:12 PM ----------

Originally Posted by Subrosa

Just an FYI US people, buying seeds from foreign vendors without proper paperwork is illegal. I don't know about you, but if I'm going to do something illegal I don't post my intentions online for all to see.

Do the import laws include seeds? I don't know much about custom laws, but I thought the laws regarding plants were because of insects and parasites that could potentially do damage to native species. Without proper paperwork won't they destroy the plants and/or seeds?

[Subrosa]

Originally Posted by Amanda L

I realized that you were looking specifically seeds after I posted my rant. LOL

I would still check out the Vendor Feedback section and see if any of the recommended ones offer seeds

---------- Post added at 09:18 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:12 PM ----------



Do the import laws include seeds? I don't know much about custom laws, but I thought the laws regarding plants were because of insects and parasites that could potentially do damage to native species. Without proper paperwork won't they destroy the plants and/or seeds?

Bet your life that importation of seeds is regulated. Yes they will destroy the stuff, but it doesn't end there. There are absolutely criminal penalties for illegally importing plant material, including seeds.

[MCSchrum]

I was under the impression that seeds and flasked plants were legal to import without a permit. The idea being that you aren't taking plants from their natural habitat.

[Subrosa]

Originally Posted by MCSchrum

I was under the impression that seeds and flasked plants were legal to import without a permit. The idea being that you aren't taking plants from their natural habitat.

Your impression is incorrect. Generally two pieces of paper are required to import plant material, an import permit from APHIS and a phytosanitary certification from the seller. There are instances where one OR the other are waived, but you always required to have at least one of these papers. For example you can import less than 12 plants without a permit but a phytosanitary is still required for each taxa. In the case of seeds there is an exemption for small lots of seed so that no phytosanitary is required, but the permit still is. And orchids are de facto exempt from the small seed lot exemption, because under the guidelines you can only import 50 or less seeds of each taxa. Nobody is going to count out 50 grains of dust, so orchid seeds require both a permit and a phytosanitary. Every time. Flasks are exempt from phytosanitary, but require the permit.

[naoki]

You are not completely right, neither, Subrosa. Or your info is a little out-dated. You can legally import orchid seeds under Small Lots of Seeds.

"There are a maximum of 50 seeds of 1 taxon (taxonomic category such as genus, species, cultivar, etc.) per packet; or a maximum weight not to exceed 10 grams of seed of 1 taxon."

It takes long time to communicate with Aphis, but I specifically asked this, and "OR" in that sentence is correct (i.e. for small seeds, you can use 10g limit instead of number of seeds).

You do need free import permit P587. It is easy to get, but takes about a month after online application. You don't need to go to the USDA office to show your ID, neither. They can call you and ask a couple questions to make sure who you are.

Then the sender has to ship seeds to the USDA inspection station (with the provided sticker). The sticker tells the people in the inspection station who is importing the seeds. So they will send the seeds to you after inspection. They don't need to give any phytosanitary certificate or CITES docs (for Appendix 2 plants). For a couple of App. 1 plants (Paphs, Phrags, and a couple others), I'm not sure about it. CITES exemption for seeds are only for App. 2, I believe.

[Subrosa]

Originally Posted by naoki

You are not completely right, neither, Subrosa. Or your info is a little out-dated. You can legally import orchid seeds under Small Lots of Seeds.

"There are a maximum of 50 seeds of 1 taxon (taxonomic category such as genus, species, cultivar, etc.) per packet; or a maximum weight not to exceed 10 grams of seed of 1 taxon."

It takes long time to communicate with Aphis, but I specifically asked this, and "OR" in that sentence is correct (i.e. for small seeds, you can use 10g limit instead of number of seeds).

You do need free import permit P587. It is easy to get, but takes about a month after online application. You don't need to go to the USDA office to show your ID, neither. They can call you and ask a couple questions to make sure who you are.

Then the sender has to ship seeds to the USDA inspection station (with the provided sticker). The sticker tells the people in the inspection station who is importing the seeds. So they will send the seeds to you after inspection. They don't need to give any phytosanitary certificate or CITES docs (for Appendix 2 plants). For a couple of App. 1 plants (Paphs, Phrags, and a couple others), I'm not sure about it. CITES exemption for seeds are only for App. 2, I believe.

The 10g option is a new one for me, but the two main points I'm trying to make are still valid. US residents can't legally buy seeds from foreign vendors without paperwork, and more importantly, posting evidence on a public forum bragging of a crime one has committed is just stupid. I have personal experience with a USFWS officer who frequented tropical fish forums posing as a hobbyist to gather evidence of illegal activities. Don't think that it's something they won't bother with, it's their job to bother with such things.

[MCSchrum]

Originally Posted by Subrosa

The 10g option is a new one for me, but the two main points I'm trying to make are still valid. US residents can't legally buy seeds from foreign vendors without paperwork, and more importantly, posting evidence on a public forum bragging of a crime one has committed is just stupid. I have personal experience with a USFWS officer who frequented tropical fish forums posing as a hobbyist to gather evidence of illegal activities. Don't think that it's something they won't bother with, it's their job to bother with such things.

I don't think anyone was bragging about breaking the law. I personally was unaware that seeds needed any sort of paperwork. It's just ignorance of the regulations on my part, not bravado.

[Subrosa]

Originally Posted by MCSchrum

I don't think anyone was bragging about breaking the law. I personally was unaware that seeds needed any sort of paperwork. It's just ignorance of the regulations on my part, not bravado.

Ok then.