Orchiata
 

This is probably dredging up old news, but I bought some Orchiata recently and I was wondering how folks who have been using it for a while are satisfied, what amendments they added, like spag.moss and how often they had to water it.

I have some of the finer and some of the larger stuff that is similar to the medium regular bark. I have used the chunkier Orchiata for some of my Catts so I don't add anything else to it. It does dry out faster so you need to water more often. However it is supposed to last a lot longer. I think it does. I honestly haven't found that my orchids do any better in it tho. Maybe in some other growing environments it would be better. And it should mean not having to replace it as often. Mine can go at least 3 years with it. But in the end, my plants and roots outgrow the pot and I re-pot anyways. So then, do I top up with newer stuff and leave the old in there? It might rot in the centre and the more recent stuff still not need re-placing. So I think once mine is gone, I will just go back to regular bark for everything. It might be good for Paphs with some moss and the finer grade of it. It might stay fresh longer than fine regular bark.

Thanks, silken. I am beginning to have second thoughts about it. Living here where the summers are extremely hot I might have to water twice a day and that is not practical. We bought a misting system late last year and we will install it this spring. I have my plants under shade cloth but on a unexpected hot day Cats. and Phals. burned severely and have yet to recover.

Some people love it and say the moisture is more evenly distributed. That may be so for some. But again, I think its the same old story, what works for some, doesn't work for others. I'm not removing mine before it gets old, just won't get more. Good luck with the heat. I grow in a greenhouse and in summer it can get really hot too. I have a misting line and a good fan vent at the top on one end to push hot air out. It all helps.

The disadvantage of the misting system is that you only need it to run in short bursts, and it will only give you 8 on off periods.

There is a way to get 16, or even 24 but it involves a bit of jiggery pokery.

If you are interested, pm me and I'll tell you how I did it.

Considering that correctly potted orchids outgrow their pot in 2-3 years, i fail to see any benefit from the reputed 10 year lifespan of this product.

I can see a benefit in the longer than necessary useful life, but I certainly wouldn't pay a premium for it.

Prior to Arcadian (the importer of Orchiata) being sold and relocated to Savannah, GA, I used to pick it up in bulk from the warehouse north of Atlanta. Couple of tidbits that I've picked up from the original owner;

If you fill up a room with just basket balls, or just marbles, you will have about 40% air space between the balls. If you mix the two together, you will have a lot less. This is the same theory with the 5 sizes of Orchiata. By using only a uniform size in a pot, you maximize the air space.

That said, I do, sometimes add some leca medium to my bark, and/or styrofoam peanuts on the bottom, and for the soggy loving plants I'll also add some Besgrow (also from Arcadian) sphagnum moss.

While Orchiata is more expensive, it has been proven to last 7 years! G-d forbid an orchid of mine dies while in Orchiata. I toss the plant, thoroughly rinse the bark, bake it for about an hour at 250 degrees, and reuse it.

If you are an overwaterer, you can water everyday in the summer time, as long as you have good airflow in your growing area.

And although this is an unpaid endorsement for their products, the Besgrow sphagnum moss, which comes in different levels of quality is fantastic, especially if you order the highest quality (AAA).

A few clarifications:

1) It was Acadian Wholesale, not Arcadian. (The Mayes are transplanted Canadians)
2) The volumetric thing originated in my S/H talk, and I shared that with Tim as part of the reason I like Orchiata.
3) How long it lasts depends a great deal on your cultural parameters.
4) The Besgrow Sphagmoss actually comes in as high as high AAAAA, but according to Tim, in the years they owned the business, they only had one request for it, so the AAA stuff they sell - which is extremely good - has been tremendous for most.

I think the primary problem folks have with Orchiata is that it is just different from anything else they've used, but without considering that, try to use it the same way as any other bark.

The primary learning point I found useful was how to pretreat it to make it absorb more water right away: you DO NOT want to soak it, as that can extract some of the beneficial nutrients added in the curing process, so I pour a small amount of boiling or VERY hot water on it (enough to wet it), wait 30 minutes and do it again. That will open up the structure and allow it to absorb water better, and once it's cool, pot those plants up.

Orchiata is also naturally populated with a trichoderma fungus, which parisitizes pathogenic fungi, making it a bit of a probiotic.

Thanks for the clarifications Ray.

Furthermore, the 'transplanted Canadians' are now Floridians. His Sis (or Sister-in-law) is still running the business but has moved back to Canada.

I can't say enough about the product, and am 'hoarding' my 9 40 qt bags of orchiata, plus a few dozen smaller bags as well.

Bil, like I said the misting system is a cheap simple thing we bought last fall on sale. It connects to a garden hose. We will put it up this spring with a timer. It only needs to come on during the worst heat, from around noon 'till 4PM.
Last year we were going to get one of the patio misting systems installed, but they take too much water and we are in a drought. There are also fans with a water ring connected to a hose that do a good job. But I will gladly share my results with you.

While it is hard to separate the usually improved growing just from repotting, I do think that I have had better results with some plants that in other media had just never rooted well. I'm in a dry climate, and have not felt that it dries out too fast. The range of grades makes it easier to match the media to the plant. (Otherwise the choice is between seedling bark and big-medium bark, neither suitable for mid-sized plants) Fortunately, I have a retail source, with reasonable prices, quite nearby... shipping expense would probably raise the premium to the level where I'd think again.

You're right, Roberta.

For example, I have found that the #5 "Power" grade (9-12 mm) is excellent for paphs in Air-Cone pots with no additives in my greenhouse, but I top-dress with sphagnum for those in my house. Many of the plants coming into the mainland out of Hawaii are in #5 or #5A, with a bit of sponge rock.

I have also found that their largest grade (#7 Super) works really well for Catts, Mexican Laelias (like anceps, etc) and relatives, which I'm more and more putting in baskets. The big chunks don't fall through the holes, and leave rather large voids, packing just enough to hold the plant. Therefore the plants dry out fast after watering.

I have been topdressing the Phals with sphagnum moss last year and will do the same with all the plants in Orchiata rather than incorporate it. Also noticed that Orchids in pots with solid sides rather than slotted ones stay damp longer. Whatever helps.

I can't speak to the technical stuff about its composition (and I'm too impatient to do what Ray suggests with the boiling water), but for what it's worth: I live in a dry climate, and I've found that plain Orchiata (even in a small size) dries out too quickly for oncidiums. I use a small size for cattleyas and dendrobiums, and I add a little sphagnum for oncidiums and others that need more water retention. They seem to like it. They definitely like it better than the coconut husk I made the mistake of using before. And it really does seem to be more resilient than regular bark.

I used coco husk for Cyms for several years, had good results for awhile, but lately the quality has really declined and the stuff that I have been able to get breaks down faster than bark. If it dries out it is hard to re-wet. I agree, I have stopped using it for anything.

I re-potted some of my orchids that really needed to be re-potted and I have found that my phal leaves are turning yellow and my zglm. Luisendorf "Rhein Clown" rhizomes are drying up. So I am having to water them a lot more which is disappointing to me. I'm thinking about adding some sphagnum moss to the mix to help with this.

The one word of advice I have is if anyone is switching from coco or regular bark to Orchiata, they do it on a 50/50 basis the first time. I speak primarily of Cyms, zygos and masdevalias but they do not like the fast turnover to Orchiata from a coco mix.

Thank you all! I think I might repot a few that seem to not be doing well in just Orchiata and add some sphag. I have added sphagnum to the tops of a few phals and to a few plants that did not have any roots to get them started and they seem to be doing okay.

Here in the UK we have a single importer and at £27 per bag the stuff is just not economic for me with +/- 800 plants. Seems like people just follow because it is the latest big idea. A bit like the kings New Clothes, but I have not yet seen long term advantages . Yes, plants grow well when repotted, but they do that anyway in any standard bark mix, and I certainly would not like to leave my plans in the same pot for several years.

Someone gave me some orchiata to try, and of the characteristics it is known for (chiefly slow break down), my sample lived up to the reputation. It is a quality bark.

However, for most of my plants (Cattleyas and Phals, with a few others), they grow just fine in much cheaper bark (approx $5/8 qt bag), outgrowing the pot before the bark decomposes. For this reason, I agree with richardb - not the economical choice for the plants I grow.

I have repotted cattleyas, phalaenopsis, and catesetums after 3 years and the bark shows no signs of decay. I repotted in larger pots without tearing up any roots and the plants still look good, growing well. I do notice a good tendency of the roots to easily penetrate down into the mix rather than skip across the top and over the edge. I used medium sized bark and nothing else.

I still like my homemade fir bark mixes....been using them for near 40 years now, and I don't have a problem with decomposition....the used media works quite well in my garden, so I really cant complain....some vandas, which I don't like to mess with repotting, I use straight large charcoal....my personal opinion...

I agree with Dounoharm. One of the first rules of orchid growing is if you have something which works for you, don't just follow the crowd and change. I have heard of people growing in gravel, seramis, and even wine corks.

Ya, that's true. I made a statement in an orchid talk I gave on potting mixes long time ago that I that orchids would grow in broken glass provided you learn how to water them right. An attendee to the talk brought me a bucket of broken glass (his daughter had trashed the patio door) and said try it. I grew L. anceps in it and it did fine. Took more water than normal. pictures from years ago

clear pot website
 

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Especially some orchids... L. anceps in a pot grows gradually, then hits the edge of the pot and takes off, a clear indication that it did not want to be in a pot I like the broken glass idea as a substitute for a mount... control the plant without its noticing that it is confined, more surface for moisture to hang around than just going bare.

Roberta, I think your assessment is actually backwards.

Plants want mechanical stability. Placing them in a loose, easy to move medium, and it's anything but. Once the plant reaches the edge of the pot, its roots can solidly "grab" onto something that gives that stability, and boom!

I just know that L. anceps grows for me much better mounted, or in a basket with minimal media (essentially, a 3-dimensional mount) It certainly needs stability so that new root tips don't get damanged - tied to a mount, or to the sides of the basket. But is as a very strong epiphyte, and grows best as it escapes any media that may be around. When I have had these in pots, the part in the pot tends not to survive - becomes rootless, leafless backbulbs quickly. The "free" part thrives and prospers. And I live i a rather dry climate.