Newly repotted phalenopsis - too much water?
 

Hi,

I had an orchid for my birthday last year - after looking on the internet, I thought it might be a good idea to repot it (some seem to advise doing this every year or two anyway, and gazing through the plastic, some of the roots did seem to be a bit mushy). Anyway, yesterday I did the deed, and my question is:
my orchid is in a new pot, with new medium (bark with volcanic rock) and very quickly there seemed to be condensation on the inside of the pot - is this a bad thing, or is this possibly a good way of seeing when to water it? (I am a predisposed to overwatering plants!)

this is the pot in question

Does the plant have roots that are plentiful and extensive that it can just fit into the pot? Or does the potting medium take up more space than the roots?

The condensation is fine - the clear pot is a good way to help see when plant needs water. Let it get to where it looks dry before watering again. Even with clear pots I like to use a bamboo skewer to check for moisture as I think relative humidity can make the pot 'look' dry even if there is moisture in it.

I'm not sure because I'm not entirely sure how much you would expect! (certainly it would have difficulty fitting in pot much shorter than the one it's in, but I don't know how much in the way of roots you would expect to see on - it didn't look like a huge amount of roots when I took it out of the first pot)
There's about an inch and a half of bark at the bottom of the pot, then a ring of roots about an inch deep. It seemed to take a lot of bark to fill in the gaps. The pot it is in is the one recommended by the garden centre, based on me giving an indication of the size of the old one (although I think measuring the diameter of the bottom of the old one was not, maybe, the best way of doing that!)

In potted culture, it's better to grow a Phalaenopsis potbound. Too much media could cause problems with over watering.

Sometimes, when I repot I put it back into the same size pot until they start showing signs of roots crawling out of the pot.

What size of wood chips are they small, medium, or large?

i would say the chips are probably small to medium

i have a picture of it in its old pot if that provides any helpful comparison - the roots were trying to escape through the bottom of the old one (which surprised me)

It's a common mistake to think that when repotting an orchid it will need to go up a pot size.

With other plants this is usually the case, you repot, leave all the old medium where it is and add more arround the edge to fill the new bigger pot. The garden center might not realise the difference with orchids and give you advice on general house plant repotting.

A relative of mine recently made this mistake and left the previous Sphag in place and moved it to a larger pot. Luckily she gave me the plant a few days later and I quickly corrected the mistake and removed the now stinking sphag and put it in a much smaller pot.

When repotting a Phal you need to remove all the existing medium and then put it back in a pot just big enough to fit the roots in. This is often the same size pot, sometimes a smaller one if some of the old roots have rotted.

To be honest I have made the mistake of not moving up a pot size when I should have done. I should have realised when I had so much trouble getting it back in the pot that it needed to go up, but it's doing well still in the old pot so it can wait till next time I repot. This one SHOULD have gone up a pot size.

http://lh6.ggpht.com/_o4OXVkcS2VU/Sg...%20%284%29.JPGhttp://lh6.ggpht.com/_o4OXVkcS2VU/Sg...mpty%20Pot.JPG

Also, when I repot, I like to always arrange some roots so I can see them through the plastic pot. It helps to keep an eye on how the roots are doing after the upheaval and also helps measure watering.

Based on those pictures, mine would possibly have coped going back into the same pot! I was a little concerned about squashing the roots - is this a problem?

Bear in mind that mine was too big for that pot, I should have gone up a size.

I'm not sure I know the right point to go up a pot size myself yet. I'm still experimenting. That one I got wrong by staying put when I should have gone up a size. Jury is still out on another one which I DID put up a pot size, which had less roots than that one, not sure yet if I should have left that one in the old pot.

Anyway, my current principle is that when it's in bark, the bark should dry within about one week, two at the most. If it takes any longer to dry then it is probably overpotted. Of course drying time also depends on enviroment but Staffodshire is not that far from me in the West Midlands so we're probably quite similar.

The one in the pics is drying within about three days and I know it's underpotted, the second one I mentioned is still damp after a week and two days and I'm keeping an eye on it.

One danger if it is overpotted is that it dries at the edges but is still damp in the center. I've not worked out yet how to check for that on the second one I mentioned.

I should have also said that I too am concerned about squishing and breaking roots, but I've found mine have coped with one or two getting broken while repotting.

Apart from the latest one I've always got them back in the old pot somehow, all have been reasonably difficult (the pictured one was the worst). I try and break as few as possible but always break some and all the ones I have repotted since April (six orchids) seem to have coped with it.

I'm actually more concerned about my latest one and should I have moved it up a size or not.

I think you'll be fine. Just make sure all the condensation is gone before you water it again. once a week might be plenty for you.

I also think it might be overpotted. Phals (and orchids and general) really do much better potbound. Generally when I repot, the 'rule' I have for myself is 'if I can fit it back in the same pot, it's fine. If not, got up one size'. All my phals have massive root systems in their pots, and the medium dries out really evenly and really quickly compared to phals in pots that are too big.

Rosie I agree with singingirl & would also add my :twocents: worth ... don't forget to take into consideration the root 'colour 'at the same time too to define if it needs watering or not?

Also, the 'skewer method' is another idea to use if you are unsure about watering a plant. I have found that by trying to put the skewer going through the 'middle' part of the pot (where we can't see) gives one a much better idea If watering is necessary or can wait another day or 2 ?It's mostly the central/middle roots that rot?
(obviously best time is at a repot) or by slowly & carefully 'twirling' the skewer into the medium & 'feeling' for the roots.

I think your plant looks fine even though, as you suggest it maybe should have gone into a larger pot.. just keep on 'watching' & keep us posted. For the moment it's looks perfectly healthy to me!

I feel a bit guilty because in trying to help Alison I've ended up getting advice on mine :blushing:

The one in the pics is doing well and I'm going to leave it where it is for at least a year. Definately underpotted but it's happy so no problem.

I'm going to use your skewer method to check the center of the medium on the one which is on the verge of being overpotted. Watering weekly is going to be too much for it (from the root colour after a week).

Anway, sorry Alison for the diversion of this thread.

So should I were to consider putting it back in the old pot, and if so, how long should I give it before I make that decision?

I'm afraid I'm not sure on that. I would try using nenella's suggestion of 'twirling' a wooden skewer in to the medium near the center. Leave it in for at least several hours, then pull it out to see if it is damp. Put it back in the same place so you can do this whenever you want to test.

If you find that it is drying out in arround a couple of weeks them my guess is that it will be OK. But don't water each time until it has dried out in the center.

That's what I'm planning with the one of mine which I'm not sure if I've overpotted.

Alison, again only my 2cents worth, (based on your description of having inches of bark round the roots, which are now no longer visible in your new pot ) I would say unpot & Try & pot back into the original pot I have a funny feeling you won't have to "squash" the roots back in as Rosie did.
In my experience re-potted phals do ALOT better "squashed" like Rosies example than "floating" in medium. But, It really depends on your growing conditions & the best advice I can give is to watch the roots & the moisture round them like a ....'hawk' so as to give the plant the best conditions. - If you look out for the signs They (the plants) "speak" to you.

[QUOTE=RosieC;235508]I should have realised when I had so much trouble getting it back in the pot that it needed to go up, but it's doing well still in the old pot so it can wait till next time I repot. This one SHOULD have gone up a pot size.QUOTE]

I'm brand new here, I just discovered this forum today, but I'd give a lot to have plants with roots like the ones in these pix! I've tried every kind of advice and still have enormous trouble keeping orchids alive, let alone flowering, but it's great to see others proving that it can be done!

Hi Stever and welcome to Orchid Board.

Yes it can be done, one of the problems is that exactly what you need to do can depend on where in the world you are and what your enviroment is like, making it very frustrating when advice you get does not work for you :evil:

First of course you need to be able to keep it alive and I'm certain the key to that is watering. Don't overwater BUT don't underwater either. I use clear pots on all my phals and I water when the roots (right down to the bottom) are silver and not before. When I water I dunk it for at least 15min (I try to keep it soaking for under 1hour but sometimes forget them and leave them a bit longer), they then drain thoroughly and go in to an outer pot which holds them off the bottom (so the inner pot is kept away from any futher dripps coming out).


As for getting them to grow so well, I'm not entirly sure what I have done with this one. My others grow well, but this one just amazes me.


The only thing I think is that I have found it's "happy spot". It is currently flowering and I've moved it so I can see the flowers from my chair and now the root/leaf growth has stopped. I don't think that's just because it is putting it's energy in to flowering (this one seems to be able to do all three at once) but because it's no longer in it's "happy spot".

But then other Phals with exactly the same treatment and in the next door "spot" just do average, so I think I'm just lucky with this one. :biggrin:

stever--i was just thinking the same thing!!!:waving