Phal need East facing windows?
 

Hi there!

I hope to get some expert advice, or... hey! Any advice at all! :)

I abs adore my Phal. It was given to me when I had an aortic dissection and nearly died four years ago.
I had NO clue how to keep it and I've learned so much, here! But, I'm still a novice, and struggling!

So... I live in Oregon and I have no East facing windows!

What is the next best? Currently the leaves on my Phal are split from who knows what!

When I received the orchid, the roots were in a plastic bag with water in them. (?) I read about Phals and thought, "This couldn't be good!" Even though, it was quite healthy and flowering.
So, I took it out and tried my best to do what I'd read. I put it in mix that had been soaked, after removing some of the mushy roots.
Well? I'm STILL not getting it right. Sometimes I think I should have left it in that plastic! Because the leaves are splitting.
I have tons of new root growth, but they are all out of the potting mix. (Air roots?)
It keeps trying to spike, but then it rots half way up the spike. Each time I get a new spike, I pray that it won't rot, but it keeps doing it! I guess praying doesn't do much for spikes. :)

So? Do you need a picture? Would that help?

Please help me. For some reason I feel like if I can keep this alive, it's a good sign for me, too! :)

Thanks!
Jen

Mine are in a south-facing window in clear plastic pots with coarse bark mix. I water when the pot looks dry and the roots turn white with green tips. Splitting leaves (at the tips) are not all that uncommon. Don't know what it means, but doesn't seem to make a difference. Just my two cents.

Oh, how thrilling! Thank you!
I can't believe I got an answer so quickly!
I'm so excited about all of this. I can truly relate to how excited you guys get when you get a new spike, etc.
I watch my plant every day. Can't wait to get up to look and see if anything new happened.
Do you think I'm crazy?
Jen

no jenn you just caught the orchid decease. we,ve all got it and there is no cure.the only thing that will not.make you absolutely mad; is to go out and buy 2 or more orchids.

If you live in the northern hemisphere, east or south are the good positions. South is better for outdoor growers.
Grow more phals, it will be easier to find something new.:lol:

Yes. I need to stick with the EASY button for now. :)

Phals are that, right?

Anyhow, yes. I asked for them for Christmas, but Santa didn't think so. Maybe he looked at my existing one. LOL

My sister, who is a plant person in downtown Portland told me to give up on it and throw it away. "Get a new one!" and told me it isn't worth the trouble to save this one. I just can't! I want to save it!

Also... I want more! More! More!

That way, I'll have more to look at in the morning and more to be excited about.

I think it's partially about the fact that my kids have left the roost and now I have new babies to care for! How can you throw your child away? :) LOL

More, more, more is always a good philosophy with orchids. Keep in mind that the more you have the more chances you have to learn. :biggrin:
I admire your persistence. :goodluck:

If it's sending out new roots and continues to grow well then it's most certainly not dying! I'm not sure what to tell you about the rotting spikes. It almost sounds like they are getting wet when you water, and then like crown rot, bacterial rot starts in the sheath of the spike and spreads like wild fire. A little more light may solve your leaf splitting problem, but only if they are splitting mid leaf, not at the tips. You might want to consider a grow light. All of my plants are in a south facing window with T5 lighting. All of my Phals (except the summer bloomers) are spiking right now.

pictures of the plant
 

Alright... Here we go!

I own another board, and I've never used it from a member's standpoint!

The gallery is so easy to use! Wonderful! Now, let's see if I can post them, here! :)

As you can see, my phal (It is a ... phal... can you tell me how to spell it? :) isn't it?

It is growing spikes every year, but then they die. I have put cinnamon on the ends so they don't further rot, but I did have to cut them off. They got a bunch of that sweet sap on them and just folder over. :( I was so disappointed.

So, I've got a bunch of half-spikes! I have never heard anyone else have this problem! I'm a failure!

But, I do have good root growth! Not long ago, (a month) I trimmed the roots because they were mushy.

Now what should I do?

Also, on the spikes, there is new growth. At least it looks that way to me, but it never does a thing but just look that way!

Can anyone help me be more productive? I would just die if it bloomed again! I got it to rebloom once, the first year. That's it! I'm keeping it alive, but barely! :)

Jen

http://www.orchidboard.com/community...rchidspike.jpg

Lookee at that little tiny green thing! That's been there for MONTHS! LOL. It won't grow OR die!

http://www.orchidboard.com/community...s/orchida1.jpg

See? I have no roots, but about four spikes doing nothing! Should I cut them back?

http://www.orchidboard.com/community...chidgrowth.jpg

What is coming out of that node? A bird? A plane? A kikki? :)

http://www.orchidboard.com/community...s/orchid10.jpg

I sure wish I knew how to post pictures like you guys do. I love the other way- where all the little pictures line up at the bottom!

Are those attachments, then?

Thank you! Is there a doctor in the house?

OK. I attached my "sick leaves" photo. The leaves are all split!

:)Attachment 24083

Oh, you guys! I'm so excited for someone to help me make this a healthier plant!

Hi Jennie, I think your Phal. needs water. The leaf and roots look a little shriveled. That could be the reason your spike blasted.

Jennie, I think Dave may be right. Shriveled leaves is a sign the plant is not getting enough water. This could be happening for a couple of reasons. 1. you aren't watering enough. 2. the root system has rotted because you've watered too much and now there is nothing left to supply the leaves with water. I'm leaning towards #1. Tell us about your watering and feeding schedule. How much and how often, etc.

I still think it needs more light. The leaves are a dark green. Phals with light colored flowers usually have medium to light grassy green leaves. I push em so they have red freckles, or reddish edges to the leaves. Phals with purple flowers will tend to always have darker leaves. The more light you throw at them the darker and more purple they get. When Phals don't get enough light they turn very dark green and the leaves seem to get enormous. The plant is trying to compensate by making more leaf. The longer the leaf gets the greater the stress it puts on the middle. Couple that with not enough water and that could be the answer to the spitting leaves. I would also cut off all the spikes. Let the plant concentrate it's energy on recovery.

I think I am agreeing with Terri. If your Phals are getting sufficient light, the leaves will be light green, not dark green. Also watch the roots. They might run to the green side if the pot is clear, but usually run white when needing water and green when there is sufficient water.

OK. I will try watering more. However, it's so hard for me to know what is right.
I water and it goes right through. I water probably once a week?
Then, I look in the bottom of the pot and it's full of water. I'm so afraid of the roots getting wet that I dump it out and think I've overwatered, so I don't for a while.

So, how much and how often SHOULD I water?

I'll go water in the morning, again.

Thanks!

Let me know, k? And really... cut off the spikes totally? I hate to, but I will!

Jen

By the way. Don't know if I mentioned it before, but when I purchased it, the roots were in a plastic bag of water. I thought that possibly couldn't be good, so I took them out.

Why would they have them in a plastic bag? Is that good? Did I mess up, taking them out of that?

Frankly, it was much healthier when it had the plastic around the roots!

What can I do for more light, though?
Get a grow light? I live in the Pac Northwest. It's in our lightest window! That's always the thing about plants, here. Never enough light! At least I don't live in Alaska!

I would water the bark mix thoroughly at least 3 times a week. But I would not let water sit under the plastic pot. In other words water thoroughly and then empty the outside pot.

http://www.ifish.net/orchid.jpg

Look what I found off my board!

This is from 2005 and I was so thrilled that it was flowering! LOL.

Do you know what KIND of orchid it is? I'm so glad I found that picture!! Hey-- it was blooming when it was in that plastic on the roots, in the pot.

Thank you! I will try that and report back! Three times a week. Should I just take it to the sink and soak it?
Should I be very careful about not getting it at the crown?

It all seems so difficult!

I'm so sorry I'm too talkative, but I got to looking around and you guys are from all over the place!

My forum is so geographically close. Everyone's from the Pac Northwest. This is so fun to meet you all from all over!

This has me wishing I lived in a warmer climate so that I could have more orchids than good sense!

Thank you for all of your help, you guys!

Jen

Hey Jennie, I'm just down the road aways from you. DH and I did a north coast trip in Sept. What city do you live in? I'm in Jacksonville, and Ross used to live in Grants Pass. There are a couple of fine orchid growers on the coast. Logsdens in Coos Bay, and JC Tropicals (don't recall what city they're in). The coast is a great place to grow orchids. Your relative humidity is much better than it is inland. You could probably grow cymbidiums outside year round.

Anyway, back to the business at hand. When was the last time you repotted this plant? Fir bark is only good for a couple of years and then it starts decomposing down inside the pot. When it does that it retains too much water and rots the roots. If you haven't repotted since you first got it, then that would be my first recommendation. It's not the ideal time of year, but sometimes you just have to do it. Repotting now will accomplish two things. You will be able to determine the health of the root system, and give it nice fresh potting medium. Be sure to soak the medium for at least 24 hours, changing the water a couple of times during that period. I would also recommend clear plastic pots. That allows you to see the roots down inside the pot and gives you a much better idea of when it's time to water again. As you're repotting clean the roots and cut off any that are black and mushy. If they are dark but firm leave them on. My Phals get watered and fed once a week. I flush the pot well, and then follow with fert water. You can easily find a good orchid fertilizer at most nurserys or hydroponics stores. One that is fairly easy to find locally is DynaGro Grow formula. Look for the urea free formula. It can also be ordered online. If you do order online I would recommend GreenCare MSU formula. I have used both and got better results with MSU.

As for lighting, yes a grow light will definitely help. Be advised though, they are VERY bright, so you may want to locate your orchid growing area to a spare bedroom. Ross is the light man. I'm sure he can recommend something specific.

:goodluck:

Hi, Jennie, possibly the orchid has been overwatered in the past - that is why the leaf in bottom photo might appear a little wrinkly? Also, if the roots were mushy might be a sign. I would mostly keep phal out of the outer decorative pot and maybe set it instead in one of those plastic pot holders you can get anywhere for under a dollar. Or, on a humidity tray. Also, it's hard to see the exact size of your plant or know the extent of its root mass, but possibly pot down if necessary? I live probably not too far from you in Long Beach, WA and I grow my phals in both the south and east windows, also grow under lights. I water a couple of times a week. I don't mist my orchids. My humidity may be close to yours in winter, around 40%. Because central heating drops the humidity, I have a couple of water fountains in my house and a warm mist humidifier. If you are afraid you'll overwater, add just a little bit of chopped sphagnum to the bark. mix. You'll get the hang of it!

As I stated earlier in the post, mine are in a bright south window (well "bright" is a relative word, isn't it?) with CF T5 bulbs strategically placed to provide supplemental lighting.

The bulbs you get at Home Depot or Menards or Lowes are not nearly bright enough. You don't need really big hot lights either. I use 54 watt and 105 watt (that's consumption - not light output) in my growing area. I've found that at our latitude and especially with the climate and gray days you get in winter, that supplemental lighting is a must. Try this site for a good choice of bulbs 105 Watt Compact Fluorescent

Here's a picture of my setup for comparison

http://www.orchidboard.com/community...bs/DSC2705.jpg I now have a 2-tube 24" t5 high output fixture to the right where the bottom shelf is in this picture.

A comment on the potting: I'm a real big fan of clear plastic pots, especially for beginners or for those not quite sure about their watering skills. I find the 3 times a week, 2 times a week, etc. instructions too vague. I just look at the pot and check out the roots and the condition of the bark. Mine tend to get pretty root-bound with big fat white roots. When I water by soaking the pot (watering in the sink should be fine as long as you don't have a water softener) the roots will all turn green. I just wait until they turn white again before watering. In the humidity of summer that might be once a week or longer. Now with the dry air and the floor vents for the furnace, I am watering every other day just to keep up. I can't imagine trying to guess with a green plastic or clay pot.

You are shooting for really light green leaves. They actualy may tinge to purple along the edges. This level of light will normally lead to the best spikes. I grow mine right in with the high light genera like Cats, Encyclia, etc.

Hope this helps

Hey Jen, Sorry for the short answers last night (I had to many distractions). Anyway after looking at your photos closely I still think it is a lack of water. The bark mix looks fresh and Dry. When my phals. need water for to long of a time the roots and lower leaves start to shrivel up. And look exactly like your look now. As for the green thing at the end of the spike, it is another spike forming but appears to have died. I would cut all the spikes to about 1 inch and step up the watering. Fertilize with 1/4 strenght MSU fertilizer. The reason for cutting the spike is to allow the plant to recover and it will reward you next blooming cycle with beautiful flowers. As far as lighting goes for you snow birds, Ross has got you covered. Good luck.

I don't have east windows, but I grow phals in both south and west windows, with supplemental light in winter. There's a period of time in late spring when the sunlight gets a little hot in those exposures, but it comes on gradually, so they have time to toughen up and adapt to it. Usually a fan run during the hottest time of day takes care of things.

I'd recommend you read all you can about phals from specialists' websites. Big Leaf Orchids, Bedford Orchids and Robert Beddard Nurseries offer excellent culture notes you can print and study at leisure. Each has a slightly different take, so you'll learn a lot from doing this. Big Leaf's notes are written especially for new, indoor growers.

My own experience has been that I learned slowly, a little more, then a little more than that, etc etc. Each summer and winter I solved some problems that came up and encountered some more. But I finally did run out of problems, so it can be done :)

Keep at it is my advice.

LOL... OK, you guys! My brain is full. May I leave the room?

I have my studying to do, for sure.

Thank you so much! You guys are so great!

Hmmm where do I start?

I have my plate full tonight, but tomorrow with coffee, I'm going to try to digest more of all of this.

Wow. I have a new hobby!

It looks to me like you have a combination problem. The leaves are wrinkled and dark green. The plant needs to be watered more often, either daily or every other day for a while. You will need to make sure you have good drainage, especially since you had some spongy roots. The plant also needs stronger sun, so I would move it to a brighter place. My plant that was in the same condition did not seem to firm up until it got better light.:goodluck:
There is controversy:hmm here about the spikes you have. I would suggest you cut them off and let the plant get stronger. It should then send up new spikes. The current ones may be a drain on your plant now. Cut them off as low as you can.

As for pictures, when you want to add one, scroll down to manage attachments, and the box will pop up and should be self explanatory:biggrin:

I love it! The flyfishdoc! :)
You guys-- I have been praising your advice, ever since I took it! I may not have been here, but I've been trying to get back here because I think of you every morning and every evening when I adore my plant's relative health!
I took your advice, cut back the stems and now!!! NOWW!!!! You guys! I have a new flower spike and three new little green things coming off of the other older spikes!!!

I'm just thrilled! At the same time, I'm scared! Scared that like last time, the flower spike will get all gooey with that sugary stuff and it will rot, there. That's what it has always done before. I'm thinking of putting cinnamon on it?

Here is what I did to save my Phal.

I dumped out the old bark I used sterilized scissors and cut out all the rotten roots. (There were many!) I put it in a slightly larger pot, and put in the new, smaller bark designed for phals.
I sprinkled cinnamon on the roots, and on any part that may get fungus, due to being open to the air.
I bought some good orchid fertilizer and began watering it more often.
As far as the light, it's just getting the same light. I still want to buy some bulbs, but I can't believe the progress I've had.
I cut the older spikes down to about 5 inches. I should have cut it more, and I still may. Seeing is believing! Just the little that I cut it has helped SO much!

I'll take a picture!

My leaves are all splitting, still and I bought a new Phal and it's leaves are splitting, too!

I read that this might be caused by getting too dry and then overwatering, so that the leaves expand and don't know how to use all that water.

Argh. I just can't get it totally right, but I'm doing better! Oh, so much better!

Jen

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There ya go!

You can see how the old roots are getting little green bumps on them? What will they be? I think it's growing off the roots, anyhow?

And then the new spike, and then another new spike under the leaves.

The new leaves that I'm growing (two of them!) are really pretty green and healthy, but kind of curled up?

Anyhow, new diagnosis, you guys? Am I doing better? I think so, but I'll wait for you to tell me!

Your plant looks good to me, Jennie. Two spikes is a pretty good sign of a healthy plant. One feebs skinny spike might be a sign of a poorly plant, but the spike I see is a fat honking one. A poor plant won't put up a spike like that. And two at once? Something to crow about.

Curled up leaves? Your leaves look normal to me-- all leaves aren't perfect,so I'd say don't worry.

Little green bumps on the roots? root branches, ie new roots forming-- again, a good sign.

Time to quit worrying and start feeling a little smug, I'd say :)

Jennie phal n4eeds East facing windows
 

Hi Jennie

I have the same problem with windows in the UK I just put mine in a South facing window behind a net curtain to shield the leaves. I also have the same problem with spikes doing nothing, can I suggest you cut the spike just above that lower node, as the top will not bloom now, put a touch of cinnamon on the cut and use sterile knife, good luck hope this works for you.

Alright. I really didn't want to cut it the first time, but now that I did and see the reward, I will cut it all the way down past the node. Thanks!

It looks like your plant is getting the care it needs and looking a lot better.

As far as the spikes go... I would not put cinnamon on them. Cinnamon is good for leaves and such but I'm afraid that on the spike it would mix with the "sap" and get all gooey and not so good.

What I would do is get a fan going somewhere in your room on low. Remember- phals love humid air that is constantly moving! If you don't have good air movement that's when fungus and rot set in.

OK! I will go breathe on it! :) :) :)

Just kidding, but I'm so dedicated, I would if it would help! LOL

A fan sounds good.

Yeah it doesn't have to be too strong of a fan, whatever feels comfortable for you. Air movement or exposure can thwart a lot of fungus and rot.

Actually it used to be believed that talking to your plants would improve their vigor because of the carbon dioxide you breath out, which they do need to grow. However, carbon dioxide is not in short supply and I'm sure they get all they could possibly use out of the ambient air in any moderately ventilated area.

Still, there is something to be said about checking on your orchid plants every day. People who do this grow better plants because they notice problems before they get out of hand.

I like knowing the scientific reason behind it, but I prefer to believe that talking to your plants is what does it, visiting them, each day. That's nice... and I do! Several times, daily! It does more good for me, than it does them, but who cares? We both benefit!

Since my kids have flown the coop, my orchids are truely my chids!

Me too! I get stressed out easily and I find that visiting my orchids relaxes me =)

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YOU GUYS! My orchid COULD NOT be more healthy!

Look at that new stalk!

It's beautiful, isn't it?

And I am the proud new Momma of BLOOMS! Soon! Do you see those?

I'm so tickled!

Thank you so much for your help!:biggrin:

Wonderful news. Be sure to post pics once you have blooms!