Help: Vandas and Dendrobiums never flowered and one not well
 

Hi

Some of my mom's orchids have never flowered and we're not sure what to do with them. If there's anything to make them healthier.

Also, one is not well (she says).

The first she's had 5 years and it never flowered.
http://www.orchidboard.com/community...5-DSC_2945.JPG

The 2nd 4 years.
http://www.orchidboard.com/community...0-DSC_2970.jpg

I'm not sure how long she's had the 3rd.
http://www.orchidboard.com/community...1-DSC_2952.JPG

The 4th she says is not doing well (what does that mean? how would i know?)
http://www.orchidboard.com/community...6-DSC_2933.JPG

Can anyone help? Give advice?

Also, how do people get that nice filmstrip way of showing their pictures?

there are several threads here you can read them in order to get help for these questions .
I think enough fertlizer is the case. looks like they need shelter too.

Repeating myself yet again, the three most common reasons a plant won't bloom are insufficient light, insufficient nutrition, or too much nitrogen.

Vanda leaves should not flop over like that, but be stiff and "spiky" pointing outward from the center. Hers looks like it is being grown too shade, possibly with both of the other two applying as well.

I don't grow many dens, but I'd bet that's the problem with that, as well.

If you can find out more about her growing conditions, watering and feeding regimen (fertilizer formula, how often, and at what concentration), it would really help.

Don't let he just move the plants into direct sun - they have to be transitioned, or will burn.

HI Lilandra
I grow many dendrobiums here and I have most of them in full sun. They are doing great. I even have on that has been blooming constantly for over a year now.
It's my personal belief that they need a lot of sun or at least partial sun.

To add to Ray's observations, while light may be an issue with the Dendros, if they are deciduous types (the first appears to be) and it is not given a rest, it will hang on to a few top leaves, but not bloom. If we knew what the species (or types were) we could respond with more authority (that means better guesses!)

Hi all
thanks for your replies!

I don't know specifics about types. I don't know how I would find out... Mom uses terms like air vanda, sun vanda, water vanda ;-)
A couple were gifts from my sister's friend.

About location:

They're outside in the tropics.

The 1st and 4th are now hanging from the eastern side of a shed. In front of it (about a feet away) is a fence with a stand growing little plants. So I think it gets almost direct sunlight.

The 3rd is hanging on the eastern side of the house...outside...from the eave...nothing really blocking it...just a wire fence.

The 2nd is currently hanging from the western side of the shed.

I can take pictures of location or anything else.

I'll try to find out more about the feeding and watering regimen and maybe the 4th has flowered before (?)

I'm just guessing here, but the Dendros may be deciduous and may be getting too much water/fertilizer during winter when the dry season normally comes. If so, I suggest telling your mom to follow the rains. When it quits for the winter, quit watering the dendro. But this is based on it being a deciduous dendro. We really need to figure out what it is.

how would we figure out what it is?

we don't have winter
we have rainy season (about june to december) and dry season (about january to may; but it still rains just not as much and not as often...maybe)

are we watering it too much in the dry season?

Hi Lilandra,

I believe those folks were right. Your mom's orchids need more sun. I have half my vandas in the full sun and other half in very bright light (under 50% shade cloth).

those Dendrobiums will flower for you if you give 'em more light. All but my seedling dendrobiums are in the full sun.

What part of the country are you from anyway? I'll be glad to help when I get the chance.

Dry season = deciduous rest which means little to no water just like in nature. This equates to winter. Tell us a bit about how the Dendros are growing now. What I mean is, do they send up a flush of green growth more-or-less around the time the rains start down there? Do most of the leaves start to turn yellow and fall off around the time the rains stop down there? If this describes your plant(s) then you have deciduous. If so, don't keep watering while the dry season is there. Let all the leaves fall off and maybe spray once in a while with water (to simulate the fogs) and wait till the plant puts out flower buds along the leafless canes. About the same time, you should be seeing new green shoots forming at the base of last year's shoots. Wait a few weeks till the flower buds are about 1/2" or so then resume watering. I'll bet the wet season rains have begun by then. All this is only true if you have a deciduous dendrobium.

Mom said she fed it a month ago. She put slow release in them (?).
She hasn't been feeding them as regularly as she used to (every two weeks) with pink orchid food (no name yet...).

She waters them every morning when we have water, otherwise every other day or every two days.

She treats all of them (the problem ones and these) the same way.

i found this

Deciduous Dendrobiums are peculiar-looking plants, becoming dry and shriveled bamboo-like canes each year after the leaves drop off. Amazingly, and lovelier by contrast, the flowers bud and bloom from the nodes (joints) of these dry canes.

here Dendrobium Orchid Care

mom thinks they're probably deciduous..

so maybe...as you say, more sun, less water...but what else?

Ross nice explanation. Thanks for it.Even we get the same problem .they bloom very rarely here as well.
I think what is lack with lilandra is repotting too.If that plant had been sitting in the same pot for 5 years that needs repotting too.
First I talked about some shelter .Here in tropics we provide 50 % sheler for them. thanks.

First:

Your Vanda not only needs more light, it needs more water. It's got thin roots. Thin roots mean it's not getting enough moisture. Not enough moisture also means droopy leaves.

I grow my Vandas in diatomite. Diatomite is a bit tricky to use, but once you figure it out, it does wonders. It is a highly porous rock and retains a lot of moisture. The medium doesn't get waterlogged like moss does, allowing your Vanda's roots to breathe. It doesn't compact or decompose so you can keep growing in the same material for years, no need for changing media. And you save time and water by using it instead of spraying or soaking the plant for 1/2 an hour. If you're growing indoors, watering once a week is good enough with diatomite. If you grow outdoors (only grow outdoors if it doesn't go below 60 degrees F), watering everyday during the warmer months will be no problem.

Vandas typically are intermediate to warm growing unless it's Vanda coerulea or Vanda coerulescens which can tolerate near freezing temperatures. Many of them grow in bright indirect sun, only a few grow in full sun. To be safe yours should be grown in bright indirect sun for half the day.

Vandas are also heavy feeders. Fertilize once every two weeks with a fertilizer that doesn't contain urea.

Second:

Your Dendrobiums look like they're alive to me. I think you just ended up with plants that go deciduous and need a rest period in order to bloom.

Deciduous Dendrobiums have canes or pseudobulbs that eventually go leafless. Usually that's right around mid fall to early winter. When this happens, do not water or fertilize. Continue watering and fertilizing in spring.

Just because the canes or pseudobulbs go deciduous doesn't mean they all look shriveled up and dead. Older canes or pseudobulbs do, new ones look the same, just leafless.

Shriveled canes or pseudobulbs may still be alive, don't remove them unless you know for sure they're dead as a doorknob.

I would grow your Dendrobium intermediate to warm, just in case, since you have no ID on them. They typically grow in moderate to bright indirect light. Only a few can tolerate full sun. Again to be safe grow in bright indirect sun for half the day.

Third:

The Dendrobium in your third pic are still babies. Of course they're not going to bloom. Blooming size is roughly 5" to 6".

Fourth:

Dendrobiums generally like to be grown very potbound. I grow a 1' tall Dendrobium odiosum in a 2" pot.

I highly recommend taking pictures of the flowers once they bloom. Then I'd try to ID them as best as possible. It's not going to be 100% correct, people are going to be in the ballpark and they can only tell you the parentage, not the cultivar name.

Thanks so much for all your suggestions and helpful words....would work on them soon, like this weekend, as suggested.....
TriniMom

1) So we should move the vanda? Someone said about not moving them immediately because it might burn?

2) Dendrobiums: we don't have winter/fall etc so what do we do? if it's leafless don't water until leaves start growing?

3) mom tells me i made a mistake and posted the wrong picture (the babies). argh! she knows they're babies. silly me! :)

and once they bloom of course i'll take pictures! :-)

thank you very much
mom and i will try doing things to them this weekend.

1. Move Vanda to brighter location a slowly.

2. Make sure Vanda gets enough water.

3. I just thought about this. But if you live in a tropical climate, if you're feeling brave enough, try growing your orchids on trees.

4. Find out when the leave drop, don't water or fertilize for three or four months or when you start seeing new babies come out. Then log the dates in a logbook. This is so you know for the future when your plants will go dormant in your growing conditions.

BTW: Once leaves drop on a cane they don't grow back on the same cane. You'll get new growth, (babies).

If you choose to grow your plants on trees, sometimes it's alot easier to grow them.

Again keep in mind the amount of light they need and the temperature range they can handle.

We live in Central Trinidad...

What an interesting way of growing vandas.
Do you fill the pot all the way up to the top? I have heard that some growers only fill one third of the pot.
Are you able to share some pics?:biggrin:
Thank you!

YOU HAVE MENTIONED THAT YOU KEEP THEM IN SHED .
Here we do not keep them in a shed but a place covered
with 50 % shade cloth or under a tree shade .
You know we do not get any winters there for no need to cover it .
Some people grow dens under palm trees in open sun.
And keeping them in a pot is not suitable for us I suppose. We get plenty of sun , moist and fert there for them grow crazy and wild it is necessary to provide ample space.

well the shed is an open place, just with a roof covering.
but as people/you have said they need more sun we will work on moving them out...slowly

i will print this and we will try our best

thanks!

Yes, I have pics. I have a Vanda coerulea and Vanda luzonica both potted in diatomite since some time last year. They've put out strong roots this spring and are continuing to sprout them from the bottom only. Both are non-blooming sized plants.

I also have a Opst 'Selene' (I'm not sure if this is the full cultivar name, and I don't know the full intergeneric hybrid name) grown in diatomite as well. Another one I grow this way is Papilionanthe vandarum. Both have been with me for around 2 or 3 years.

Recently I purchased a blooming sized Vanda merillii and potted it in diatomite. I will post a pic of it later if you like.

BTW Opst is some sort of intergeneric cross of Rhynchostylis. Opst 'Selene' definitely has Rhynchostylis gigantea in its bloodline. I don't know what the other parent is.

Here're more pics of Vanda coerulea and Vanda luzonica.

Hi
 

This is how we mount them on a tree or some block of wood.wood

Hi
 

this is mounted on a tree .they get ample sun light .

Thank you for posting the pictures.
I am waiting for my delivery of diatomite on Wednesday.
I will be putting some in my vanda pots, I think the diatomite will help with my low humidity.
Thanks again for sharing.

You'r welcome Buds. :)

Now that's what I'm talkin' about Thakshila!

Orchids are so much easier to grow when they're tied to a tree, and the temperature and climate are all in it's favor. It really doesn't matter where you are in the world. Just know your plant.

just an update

we moved (repotted, split) some of our front plants to the Western fence. actually we've tied a lot of them to the fence.

and we're trying to water more.

i'm trying to keep a proper log of what we're doing and what the orchids are doing

mom says we have another orchid problem :-(

Really? What is it?

my mother says this beauty

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3106/...62924706_m.jpg

has weird spots on it now

on the leaves

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3129/...348a8b70_m.jpg

This one actually has a tag. It says V Bogus Sunspots and this is the link to all the pictures I took of it.

Do you think anything is wrong with it?
I mean when in bloom it had spots on it...the flowers I mean.

The flower itself looks like it's supposed to have little spots on it. That's probably why the cultivar name is Vanda 'Bogus Sunspots'.

yes, i figured that...but the leaves too?

The spots on the leaves could be insect damage, or sunburn if there were water droplets on them.

Hi!

Oh you're probably right.
Insect damage.
A little while ago there were ants running all over it.
Mom wash it down with water and then spray it with...a mix of dishwashing liquid (1/4 tsp), 1/4 tsp bleach and 1/2 gal water.

Do we have to worry? do anything? or will it recover?

I think it'll be fine. Just watch it to see if anything else new happens. I think the damage on the leaves has healed.