Dendrobium resting phase or wrinkling stem no leaf disease?

[Dollythehun]

Originally Posted by Optimist

You can tell the difference between Dend-Phal, and Nobile by where their flowers/spikes come out. Dend-phal is at the top of the stalk, and the spikes are often longer, and Nobile is all the way down the spike at each node on short spikes. Noble goes into rest, not Dend-phal. Rest means you water too, but not at an extravagant amount. Where they originate, they are watered all year long due to mists in winter. Rest phase never means "no water."

Optimist, my Den Phals spike from anywhere they choose, usually in the upper third of the cane.

NO ICE CUBES! That is plant abuse.

[Elfkin]

Do I'm too understand they like their rot ball to remain covered and keep the sphagnum moss around it? I replaced it about two weeks ago to a bigger pot and basically tried to use she medium. Cheated out a lot of old dead roots that we're wasting dosage. In process of owning a Flickr account to share photos. Thanks to you all for all y'all hello!

---------- Post added at 11:34 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:37 AM ----------

I've posted more then five replies and have the image icon, I put the URL in and it says I can't post that many images yet or it contains foul language.any idea? Should I contact an admin? Like I said I'm new and not sure about these things. Thanks. My pictures are so eager to get to you all!

[Dollythehun]

It should say Go Advanced" under the reply text box. There is a paper clip at the top. . Then it will pop up anther screen for you to choose files. They have to be resized and I use Image Shrink app for that.

[Elfkin]

Stalk and medium. This was after the hydrogen peroxide rinse, you can see all the bubbles at the roots she medium. I read about on several pages about bacterial infections. I hope I didn't kill my orchids. I keep reading so I guess it's one at a time. Thanks for the sizing info Dolly. And your help Optimist. I attached the photos but my only option was to close the window. I hope I didn't shrink them too much! They are saga. Wears a good size?

Again, thanks everyone!!!

[Sharon's Sheepdogs]

There has been a lot of controversey lately regarding the use of hydrogen peroxide on people and apparently it applies to orchids as well. On humans, I understand it can cause more damage because, as someone noted beforehand, it is caustic.

That being said, I use it initially if I suspect there is any type of disease to see if it will stop the progression of it.
It is literally the first thing I reach for.

Whenever I cut a rotting area off of a leaf or stem, I pour peroxide on it & dust with sulfur or cinnamon. I do this for 3 days in a row to make sure the rot is stopped. I watch to see if any bubbling develops on the wound because that indicates to me there is still some disease left. After three days, I usually do not detect bubbling after using the peroxide so I dust one final time & let the area dry.

Also, many people have been successful using it on phals for crown rot. I understand you pour the peroxide into the crown and let it sit for 5 min. & then turn the orchid on its side to allow the peroxide to completely drain out of it. It is my understanding that hydrogen peroxide quickly turns to water so you don't want to leave it sitting in the crown.

Where I run into problems using Hydrogen peroxide is on new roots which turn the root tips brown so I completely avoid using it on those roots and if I accidentally pour it on the new ones, I rinse with water right away.

I have never had a problem with using Hydrogen Peroxide on older roots though. However, because of the controversey over its use, if I suspect a rotting problem in the root area, I remove the medium & soak the roots in Hydrogen Peroxide for just a couple minutes. I might do this for two more days but only for a minute or two. I then replant in a new medium and pray (only kidding).

I just watch to see if the symptoms return and, if so, decide on a new line of attack. In my use of Hydrogen peroxide on orchids, I have found it to be more helpful than harmful but I suspect it's all in how you are using it. Anybody else having problems with its use?

[bil]

Originally Posted by Sharon's Sheepdogs

Whenever I cut a rotting area off of a leaf or stem, I pour peroxide on it & dust with sulfur or cinnamon. I do this for 3 days in a row to make sure the rot is stopped. I watch to see if any bubbling develops on the wound because that indicates to me there is still some disease left. After three days, I usually do not detect bubbling after using the peroxide so I dust one final time & let the area dry.

Also, many people have been successful using it on phals for crown rot. I understand you pour the peroxide into the crown and let it sit for 5 min. & then turn the orchid on its side to allow the peroxide to completely drain out of it. It is my understanding that hydrogen peroxide quickly turns to water so you don't want to leave it sitting in the crown.

Where I run into problems using Hydrogen peroxide is on new roots which turn the root tips brown so I completely avoid using it on those roots and if I accidentally pour it on the new ones, I rinse with water right away.

I have never had a problem with using Hydrogen Peroxide on older roots though. However, because of the controversey over its use, if I suspect a rotting problem in the root area, I remove the medium & soak the roots in Hydrogen Peroxide for just a couple minutes. I might do this for two more days but only for a minute or two. I then replant in a new medium and pray (only kidding).

I just watch to see if the symptoms return and, if so, decide on a new line of attack. In my use of Hydrogen peroxide on orchids, I have found it to be more helpful than harmful but I suspect it's all in how you are using it. Anybody else having problems with its use?

Oh boy. OK, take the Hydrogen peroxide and put it far away from the orchids. It is an indiscriminate oxidiser. Basically it fizzes because it is burning away organic material. Now organic material isn't just nasties, it's also the roots.
Basically, pouring it on an orchid is EXACTLY like pouring sulphuric acid on it. It isn't being helpful, it is being very, very harmful.
If you cut out rot, dust the cut edge with cinnamon, or fungicide powder and leave it alone. Dipping the edge in hydrogen peroxide is just damaging it some more.

Phals and crown rot. Once that sets in I know of no cure. Burning the rot out is infeasible, as it usually means that the core of the orchid is catastrophically damaged, and not worth the effort of saving.

Look at it like this. The only cure for deepset rot is to remove the rotted part. Cut the crown out and what is left on a phal?

" I understand you pour the peroxide into the crown and let it sit for 5 min. & then turn the orchid on its side to allow the peroxide to completely drain out of it. It is my understanding that hydrogen peroxide quickly turns to water so you don't want to leave it sitting in the crown."

OK, peroxide turns to water, but it eats holes in things. You cannot fill the crown of a phal with liquid as it drains out in seconds. Try it with water. For the last two years I have religiously washed the leaves off and filled the crowns of every phal I possess. The water drains out in seconds, and does no harm. It isn't water, it's too much cold and heat that initiates crown rot (or damage that lets in fungus).
You should water with room temp water in the mornings to make sure that they aren't chilled, or left too wet of an evening if it might be cold.

[Elfkin]

Sharon, I, like you it seems would prefer to go natural I liked the hydrogen and cinnamon rot tipping and wish I had known that when I was replanting my plants. I accidentally cut a cooked of good roots.

Regarding the caustic nature of hydrogen peroxide, it IS VERY caustic products that are pure with few stabilizers generally have a pH between 1 and 4, while products heavily diluted have a pH level from 4 to 5. They would NEVER sell something with litter then a 4 ph due to caustic burns on humans, and thief pants, do from a chemical point of view, I think the caustic "scare" is a bit overexagerated, but as with all things, er ron the side of gentle use and caution.

Other than the rest of the conversation, everything I've read about root rot, throw out the plant and cry.

I think again write about doing something to phaelos with peroxide,, can you explain why?

Than you again and Bil. Bil, I can Sworky appreciated your concerned but thug peroxide isn't killing tissue, it's cellular structured, the wall is mite implemented than human skin. From a biological perspective, it's killing every bacteria it's coming in contact with.

I'm just going on with peroxide chemistry and biology from my degrees, y'all are the actual experts here shed I don't mean to undermine anyone and their years of personal and professional knowledge. I apologize in advance if it seems that way.

[bil]

Originally Posted by Elfkin

Sharon, I, like you it seems would prefer to go natural I liked the hydrogen and cinnamon rot tipping and wish I had known that when I was replanting my plants. I accidentally cut a cooked of good roots.

Regarding the caustic nature of hydrogen peroxide, it IS VERY caustic products that are pure with few stabilizers generally have a pH between 1 and 4, while products heavily diluted have a pH level from 4 to 5. They would NEVER sell something with litter then a 4 ph due to caustic burns on humans, and thief pants, do from a chemical point of view, I think the caustic "scare" is a bit overexagerated, but as with all things, er ron the side of gentle use and caution.

Other than the rest of the conversation, everything I've read about root rot, throw out the plant and cry.

I think again write about doing something to phaelos with peroxide,, can you explain why?

Than you again and Bil. Bil, I can Sworky appreciated your concerned but thug peroxide isn't killing tissue, it's cellular structured, the wall is mite implemented than human skin. From a biological perspective, it's killing every bacteria it's coming in contact with.

I'm just going on with peroxide chemistry and biology from my degrees, y'all are the actual experts here shed I don't mean to undermine anyone and their years of personal and professional knowledge. I apologize in advance if it seems that way.

Good to hear someone with real knowledge. Me, I am just amused when people want to be natural and then pour Peroxide on a plant in such quantities that the whole surface of the medium is foaming.

As for it killing bacteria, well, again from my studies of ecological environments back in the day, indiscriminate killing usually favours the nasty life forms. It's like when you blitz a plant with pesticides, to get rid of the aphids. Bot aphids and ladybird larvae all die, and the aphids will be back way faster than the ladybirds.
There is no evidence at all as far as I can see that this is a bacterial problem, so I don't think that peroxide is the best idea. You may be right that overall the plant tissues would be somewhat resistant, but the delicate root tips?
Physan or some other bacteriacide would surely be a more sensible choice, as you can soak the pot in that without burning root tips. Plus, how do you tell when peroxide has removed all the nasties? As long as there is oxidiseable material in there, like bark, or moss, or root tips, the peroxide will continue to fizz.

---------- Post added at 06:27 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:23 PM ----------

PS, Den phals take some killing. In your shoes I would wash it off, repot it in fine bark and water as per normal. You could also harvest a cane, wrap it in moss, lay it horizontally and fill the pot to cover it with fine bark.

I have saved a number of den phals with that technique, even some that looked like the compost heap was the only option.

[estación seca]

Hydrogen peroxide, in the presence of something that triggers the reaction, decomposes and releases free hydroxyl radicals (•OH, where the dot represents a very hungry, energetic and unpaired electron.) These are exceptionally reactive. They may combine with each other to form water plus one free oxygen radical (•O.) One free oxygen radical can combine with another to form molecular oxygen, O2. Or, any of the hydroxyl or free oxygen radicals (•OH or •O) may combine with some other molecule nearby and damage it, like cell walls of orchid roots, bacteria or fungi. Hydrogen peroxide bleaches hair because the free radicals bind to melanin, the mammalian dark pigment, and render it incapable of absorbing light.

Hydrogen peroxide hasn't been to horticulture school and can't surf the Internet. It can't tell the difference between orchids, fungi, bacteria, your eye, the melanin in your hair, the dye in your clothing, or any other kind of thing to combine with and damage. Most plants and animals have some sort of protective covering over most of their dry, air-exposed tissues that provide somewhat of a barrier to injury. Normally internal and moist parts will be quickly damaged by hydrogen peroxide. If you don't believe this put some in your mouth and swish it around.

Rotting areas of plants tend to be moist, and the exterior waxy layer is broken down. Hydrogen peroxide may kill plant and pathogen cells in such an area. But we try to keep it off roots.

[Dollythehun]

Originally Posted by Elfkin

I've had a den for a year. It was facing south indoors at a window. After a few months the leaves yellowed and fell off. Now I have three wrinkly stalks that are doing nothing. It's been this way for about 6 months. I purchased it in bloom and read they go into resting phase after. I read an article that it could be bacterial and to use hydrogen peroxide on it. I did and as soon as it hit the roots and media it bubbles like crazy. I wish I could post a picture. I've gone through all of orcgidboards descriptions and none fit. Any ideas or suggestions? It's perfectly happy in the roots and having wrinkly stems thanks, I'm a novice.

If this plants has good roots, pot it in some good bark, care for it as described in this thread and quit overthinkng it. They are tough and it's probably ready to start new growth.