Potassium permanganate?

[Angurek]

I'm curious about how one can obtain this chemical "over the counter," since I want to explore it as an antibacterial option for my orchids. It's used pretty extensively in every chemistry course on campus, but I doubt I'd be able to bring some home for my plants.

Moreover, what's the proper dosage for home use? I want to kill the nasties that are destroying my plants, not the plants themselves. I tried Phyton 27 on one plant and ended up killing both it and the diseases it had. I'm probably not going to use Copper-based products again in the future.

[Bud]

Are you sure that potassium permanganate is good for your orchids...but let me tell you that it is a salt consisting of K+ and MnO4− ions. Formerly known as permanganate of potash or Condy's crystals,(plants die from salts)...and if combined with sulfuric acid, or gets in touch with glycerine or a simple alcohol...it will explode. You dont know how it will react to your plants fertilizer which has nitrogen and some other chemicals.
It is an oxidant so avoid any oxidizing agents to get in contact with it...
It also gives a dark brown stain, so your plant leaves will have that nasty dark stain...
I will just deal with the copper which I can flush with lots of water out of the roots of my plants.

[fishmommy]

I used to get it from better aquarium supply places. They use it to disinfect stuff.
It stains like crazy, so be careful with it!

[dounoharm]

phyton 27 is very effective for me and i havent killed a plant yet with it....it wrecks havoc on buds and blooms, but the plants themselves are fine....i have two dendrobiums which dont like it and get horrible spotted leaves from it, but it works great as fungicide and bacteriacide....maybe when you used it you used too strong a mixture? i think you should give it another try, but be very careful with the dosage....gl

[BikerDoc5968]

The copper ion is very useful as a disinfectant. It is incorporated into wall and flooring tiles used in hospitals for this very reason. It imparts a blue~green color to the tiles. The bottle of Phyton has specific directions for its dilution. I have also purchased CuSo4 at Home Depot in the plumbing department. It is sold as a method of clearing drains from tree roots. You have to mix up the 21% solution and then dilute this to be used on plants. The stuff is very cheap.

[PaphMadMan]

Except at very low concentrations (that might not be effective) potassium permanganate is likely to be much harder on plants than Phyton 27 used as directed. Otherwise I would expect it to be similar in its use and effectiveness in terms of killing bacteria and fungi. Have you seen instructions somewhere on the concentration for using it as you plan?

Tough leaves or pseudobuls with no damage should be fairly safe, but soft or fuzzy leaves and stems, root tips (definitely root hairs on Paphs) and any cut or broken tissues will quite easily be badly damaged. And remember that even a dilute solution will get concentrated as it dries. I would only see it as a last resort for an infection that will otherwise kill the plant, or an effective disinfectant for tools or hard non-porous surfaces, if the staining is not a problem.

Potassium is a common constituent of fertlizers, of course, and manganese is an essential trace element. Low contentrations will not hurt plants, even the strongly oxidizing permanagate ion. There is also no danger from potential reactions with fertlizers as someone suggested - unless perhaps if you mix several ounces (powders/solids, not solutions) of each together with just a trace of moisture or some organic material. There is always some fire hazard with strong oxidizers, and potential explosion hazard if you handle large quantities carelessly.

[BikerDoc5968]

Originally Posted by PaphMadMan

Except at very low concentrations (that might not be effective) potassium permanganate is likely to be much harder on plants than Phyton 27 used as directed. Otherwise I would expect it to be similar in its use and effectiveness in terms of killing bacteria and fungi. Have you seen instructions somewhere on the concentration for using it as you plan?

Tough leaves or pseudobuls with no damage should be fairly safe, but soft or fuzzy leaves and stems, root tips (definitely root hairs on Paphs) and any cut or broken tissues will quite easily be badly damaged. And remember that even a dilute solution will get concentrated as it dries. I would only see it as a last resort for an infection that will otherwise kill the plant, or an effective disinfectant for tools or hard non-porous surfaces, if the staining is not a problem.

Potassium is a common constituent of fertlizers, of course, and manganese is an essential trace element. Low contentrations will not hurt plants, even the strongly oxidizing permanagate ion. There is also no danger from potential reactions with fertlizers as someone suggested - unless perhaps if you mix several ounces (powders/solids, not solutions) of each together with just a trace of moisture or some organic material. There is always some fire hazard with strong oxidizers, and potential explosion hazard if you handle large quantities carelessly.

I can't agree enough. What is the point of risking your plants, not to mention your own safety, when there are other methods. I've been fighting Erwinia on my Phals. Let me tell you, you definitely DO NOT want this bacterial infection!!!! So far using SA 20 (Physan-20), Peroxide and cinnamon seem to be doing the trick. I did apply some CuSO4 but wasn't impressed... could be the concentration I made.... backyard chemist. But it has been a very steep up hill battle and my Phals have suffered greatly.

[fishmommy]

it is used routinely as a dip for aquatic plants, but I've never used it on a non-aquatic. dosages are easily googled 'potassium permanganate plants' and you'll have to experiment with dipping times because there's probably a difference between what you're doing and what aquatic plants can take.
I would certainly try it on a plant you don't care about first ;-) but I know from experience that aquatic plants take it unphased.

If you really don't care about the plant, really really, then you could even try the other routine (but harsher) dip we use in aquatic plant circles.....diluted bleach! that stuff will kill anything, but doesn't usually kill the plant. I think the ratio on that is 20:1 water:bleach.

I wouldn't do it with my orchids, just telling you what's out there.

[DavidCampen]

As people have noted, it is widely available. From aquarium stores and also from household water treatment supply shops where it is sold to regenerate the "green sand" that is used to remove iron from household water.
Potassium Permanganate

I would use it to spot treat rots or fungal infections but not as a spray (since it stains so much).

I have decided to use a 1% solution to sterilize my cutting shears. From my research I have found that only oxidizing or chlorinating agents like hypochlorite (bleach), Virkon S (sodium persulfate), chlorine dioxide and potassium permanganate are effective sterilizing agents for many plant viruses. I decided on permanganate as the least corrosive and most stable of these (and also I found a 1 pound bottle in my chemicals storage closet). I also liked Virkon S but I can only find it in large pails for about $70.

[goodgollymissmolly]

This an aggressive oxidizing agent, not to mention vicious purple stain. Y'all amateur chemists are asking for trouble. Be darn sure you don't get it around a chlorine bleach or anything that is easily oxidized because it can be explosive. It makes no sense to user this material when safer alternatives exist.