Smuggling wild orchids :(

[Uechi]

The real crime is that these and other stolen orchids never get returned to the wild and most don't survive. If CITES and the inernational community is really serious about protecting wild plants and animals they need a procedure in place to keep the orchids alive so they can be cloned and someday plants could be returned to the wild. If the wild is still there. Orchids are like illegal drugs as long as there is a desire for them, a shortage of them and a profit motive you will never stop the traffic. Wake up CITES. Please note more orchids, many rare or new are destroyed every year for new building projects, roads and farms and CITES and the respective governments won't allow collectors to get them before they a burned or crushed under a bulldozer makes real sense to me.

[Gin]

I spent 2 weeks helping a friend with (permits) remove Cyps. from what would become a road . Ferns 6 foot tall, peat bogs with beautiful plants gone Developers seem to go to natural beautiful areas and turn them into parking lots .. I need anger management
The thieves should be made to replace and replant every one of the plants .. Gin

[Uechi]

Gin, absolutley right Its' good that your friends were allowed permits very often they don't get issued by the particular Government or CITES. The idea behind CITES is great it needs to be run by Scientists and responsible Orchid growers and professionals. As it stands right now the major influence and decision making processes arre left up to the attorneys and politicians. You know what happens went that is done. What a joke. As awful and as bad as stealing orchids is, it was the normal means of obtaining speciments less than 100 years ago. I would rather see a thief get a plant and have it cloned than to lose that species to so called development. I sure wish there was a reasonable answer. The best I can see is either a major change in how CITES operates or a new organization run by people other than lawyers.

[Tindomul]

I hope they turn over the plants to their local botanists. Why destroy the plants? That doesn't make any sense.

[cloudswinger]

Originally Posted by Tindomul

I hope they turn over the plants to their local botanists. Why destroy the plants? That doesn't make any sense.

I can't imagine the US gov. handing over anything to anybody voluntarily, and on top of that, those smuggled orchids are not native plants, they're exotics coming into the US, with possible pests and diseases. Ideally they should be sent back, but since no one is paying for that, it's easier to send things to the incinerator. I can see the reasons for not keeping them in the US, it's obvious with all the exotics in the Florida ecosystem already and the resultant damages.
Plus if you quarantine, who takes care of those plants? And for a case like this, who would you release the plants to?

CITES is just a treaty, and countries only have to voluntary adhere. And it's up to the countries to frame their laws according to CITES. And up to the countries to enforce. And it's a UN thing, so of course it's underfunded. And the US hasn't paid it's share for this year yet.

[Tindomul]

Originally Posted by cloudswinger

Plus if you quarantine, who takes care of those plants? And for a case like this, who would you release the plants to?

I would say professional botanists who would do research on this, or grow them at botanical gardens, or something like that. Professional scientists who would be responsible with that charge.

[stonedragonfarms]

Originally Posted by Tindomul

I would say professional botanists who would do research on this, or grow them at botanical gardens, or something like that. Professional scientists who would be responsible with that charge.

I know that many plants which have been confiscated have been sent to the Frederik Meijer gardens here in Michigan for propogation/quarentine...after an undetermined period, they are made available to nurseries for further propogation and eventual sale to the public. I am against smuggling and ripping things out of their natural environment, but I agree with the earlier posts that plants which are bound for destruction should be able to be removed...further more, the person(s) removing these plants should have some say in what gets done with them. If we can treat and disseminate shipments of fruit and agricultural produce world-wide, surely we can do the same to flora which is collected and will be entering our country. Just my
Adam

[unhappykat]

I forget, When was CITIES enacted? I have a division of a plant whose tag says it was collected in India and sent to a former member of my society quite a few years ago, as far as I know there are two divisions, mine and another members plant and its pollen has never been used in hybridizing or self pollination. I wonder if its illegal?

[stonedragonfarms]

Originally Posted by unhappykat

I forget, When was CITIES enacted? I have a division of a plant whose tag says it was collected in India and sent to a former member of my society quite a few years ago, as far as I know there are two divisions, mine and another members plant and its pollen has never been used in hybridizing or self pollination. I wonder if its illegal?

Correct me if I am wrong, but anything that was discovered before 1990 (and is in your collection) would be "legal"; anything discovered after that date falls into a grey area, as does anything that was wild collected and shipped after that date...then again, you enter further grey area depending on where it's from...Taiwan does not belong to CITES, so plants which are shipped from there, which bear the moniker "artificially propogated & nursery grown"--which indeed might not be, would still be legal... ARGH!

[Stasisgate]

Originally Posted by Uechi

The real crime is that these and other stolen orchids never get returned to the wild and most don't survive. If CITES and the inernational community is really serious about protecting wild plants and animals they need a procedure in place to keep the orchids alive so they can be cloned and someday plants could be returned to the wild. If the wild is still there. Orchids are like illegal drugs as long as there is a desire for them, a shortage of them and a profit motive you will never stop the traffic. Wake up CITES. Please note more orchids, many rare or new are destroyed every year for new building projects, roads and farms and CITES and the respective governments won't allow collectors to get them before they a burned or crushed under a bulldozer makes real sense to me.

You know I have to totally agree with this. No matter what they do ppl will constantly take these wild orchids from their habitat. I see it al the time here. I actually monitor the wild orchids near my home, check on them ever week or so, and luckily the majority are still there. But.... ppl are still making off with them. CITES should have some sort of system/project/plan to grow and replace these native orchids (away from searching eyes). There are so many housing projects going up and because of the lack of law enforcement (luckily) ppl interested in saving the orchids can go in and see what they can save but most of the time they clear the land so quickly that the orchids are lost. It's such a pity.