Degarmoara Hani 'Star of Unicorn' strange discoloration - Page 2 - Orchid Board

lotis146 · #11 09-30-2014, 01:24 AM

Oh gosh, but it's in spike/bud...MUST...SEE...FLOWERS!

This plant has only three pbulbs, the two mature ones are infected. I've not found anything that looks like what my plant has. It "sounds" like it's a form of rot, maybe black rot EXCEPT that it's not black, not dark almost at all. It's not soft, doesn't smell, has me confused. Now I've stalled applying neem because it seems a lot of other treatments say to wait a couple weeks after using Neem oil. The concentrate bottle markets itself as insecticide/miticide/fungicide but I don't suppose it's a good candidate for what I may be facing...?

Leafmite, you say alcohol? Is that just a temporary treatment or...what exactly do you mean it disinfects it?

Thanks for your help. Hopefully I didn't screw up royally and contaminate my entire collection with my bad watering choice...*sigh*...

Leafmite · #12 09-30-2014, 02:02 AM

It might be bacterial brown rot. Just keep it away from the other orchids and keep a close eye on any that shared that water. I use alcohol as a disinfectant. It won't help once the infection has already begun but I use it to prevent the spread of infection. You cannot spray it on roots or spikes/buds as it dries them out too much. I would bleach the container that you use for soaking your orchids, too.

lotis146 · #13 09-30-2014, 03:21 PM

Thanks Leafmite, I believe your diagnosis is correct. The discoloration is now becoming soft. I wish I had known what to do from the door as clearly I first noticed it in the beginning, but this is my first run around with this so now I know. It seems Physan 20 is what I'm going to want to treat with. I don't recall exactly which plants were in with it though I know at least some that weren't. Nevertheless I think I'm going to treat everyone with it. Have you dealt with this rot before? Presumably I've lost this plant.

This watering took place with KelpMax, here I thought i was doing everybody a favor but now I'm worried. I know my Zygo/Ptpm hybrid came after it, that's in spike now too...if you recommend anything other than Physan let me know. Thanks again for all your help.

Leafmite · #14 09-30-2014, 04:20 PM

I am sorry to hear it is really Brown Rot. Brown rot is pretty rare but it is a bacterial infection and can spread. Make certain that whatever you use kills bacteria. A fungicide will not work. Disinfecting your other plants with alcohol will kill the bacteria on the surface of an orchid but you will need to do it a few times. Spraying roots or buds will cause them to shrivel so try to avoid that. Avoid misting and getting water in the leaves, keep the orchids warm and dry.
I dealt with Black rot due to calcium deficiency (I had always just used my pond water for my plants and when I broke down the pond, I began to use fertilizers. I did not realize that, unlike other specific fertilizers, orchid fertilizers do not contain all the nutrients orchids need. Yeah, that was pretty bad.)
I also have dealt with Brown rot with the milt and a seedling Cattleya. I managed to save the Cattleya by chopping and isopropyl alcohol but it was brutal and nasty. The Cattleya did fully recover, surprisingly.

Long term? Just give your orchids good nutrition and care. That normally prevents most problems. Plants need a variety of 'micro' and 'macro' nutrients for healthy growth.
Short term? Just keep watching all your orchids closely for the next few weeks. If the bacteria is present, stress might cause an orchid to succumb. The moment you see it, chop what is infected and use alcohol to disinfect the plant. After a month, you are probably okay.
Good luck!

lotis146 · #15 10-09-2014, 02:02 AM

Thanks again Leafmite, you help has been greatly appreciated. So due to having other things to do in my life and a fair amount of rain and cold weather I couldn't get to dousing my plants in Physan 20 like I've wanted until oh tonight...which is in the 40s, yup shame on me, but i put them in the garage afterwards so it should be warmer, a bit. I really would prefer not to use something so strong but the chance of contamination of most if not all my other plants is really high. Before it gets too cold to be outside period I'm dousing the entire group and hoping this one shot will be enough to cover my butt. Why am I going on about this again?

Well It's been over a week since I brought this up in the first place and even longer since I first saw the signs of this disease. I've watched the youngest/in spike pbulb turn completely orange-brown INSIDE and the streaking on the leaf increased a bit and turned a darker, almost black color. Then that leaf has been turning yellow. Meanwhile, the next youngest pbulb started getting some streaking on the leaf and some of this orange-brown color traveling into it. While I thought it was starting to get soft I've noticed that in fact it's not, nor does it smell. Even when I took it from the pot and started pulling the media off I put it up to my nose and NOTHING, no smell.

I preceded to soak the entire plant in Physan 20 at the strength required for brown rot, all but the spike.

After removing from pot I discovered two pbulbs completely buried in the medium. I was concerned with the smallest as it had a almost dime size black spot that didn't wipe away, so I cut it off. Then I thought the next had a soft spot (with one good leaf) and I cut it off too only to regret having done that...anyways, I cut the oldest two from the youngest two, then soaked them both for 10+ minutes, soaked some bark in the Physan too, removed them, put cinnamon on the "wounds" and potted them up separately in the new bark. I did btw leave the "sickest" bulb intact and cut in half its buddy away, topped off with cinnamon.

This is maybe a bit of a crap shoot beginner's experiment, especially seeing as I saved the spiked bulb along with its half cut off buddy...I see you people grimacing/frowning at me!! ... If things get worse, especially after it blooms I'm tossing it, but maybe the older two will survive...? I do know to keep them both isolated. I'm surprised though from what I've read about brown rot that it's not soft and it doesn't smell. The guy I bought the Physan from said when I smell the roots/pot it will stink, but no so I'm holding out a small percentage of hope, even if I just cut that in half...no pun intended.

Of course I'll be back with an update...Feel free to give your opinion