Is this a Den. nobile or Den. phalaenopsis?

[ramonypony]

Soft-canes, hard-canes, flower spike only, flowers all along cane, flexible leaves, rigid leaves-- I'm confused!

I'm thinking it's a nobile? What do y'all think?

I just repotted this orchid, and I'm glad I did. There was sphagnum packed into the root ball, *GASP!*

[Fairorchids]

It is not a Den phalaenopsis type.

At first glance it looks like a nobile type. However, it appears to have leaves on all bulbs, and nobile types are decideous, so it is not a nobile type either.

There is nothing wrong with spaghnum in the rootball for Dendrobiums potted in small clay pots. As a matter of fact, that is how I grow most of my Dendrobiums (I only use a significant amount of bark for my kingianums & other Aussies).

Last comment, you could probably have used a pot one size smaller. Dendrobiums like being in small pots.

[ramonypony]

Originally Posted by Fairorchids

It is not a Den phalaenopsis type.

At first glance it looks like a nobile type. However, it appears to have leaves on all bulbs, and nobile types are decideous, so it is not a nobile type either.

There is nothing wrong with spaghnum in the rootball for Dendrobiums potted in small clay pots. As a matter of fact, that is how I grow most of my Dendrobiums (I only use a significant amount of bark for my kingianums & other Aussies).

Last comment, you could probably have used a pot one size smaller. Dendrobiums like being in small pots.

It was in a plastic pot slightly bigger than this one, I potted down. I would have used a slightly smaller pot than this if I had one. The roots were very tight around the sphagnum ball and it would have rotted out those roots had I left it there. I saw a little rot starting to develop.

So, if it's not a nobile or a phalaenopsis.. well, I just want to know if it will need a winter rest. If it starts dropping leaves then does that mean it needs a winter rest?

[HighSeas]

Thanks for posting this thread! I've been wanting to learn more about Dendrobiums myself. I only have a few, most given to me....and I have NO earthly idea how to grow them even though I've read about "winter rests". What's confusing is that there are different types of Dends and different culture. I do have two getting ready to bloom...and I have NO idea how I lucked up on that!

It certainly wasn't "skill" or even that I "almost" knew what I was doing!

[gnathaniel]

Nice plant! It looks like a hybrid in section Dendrobium (of genus Dendrobium), more commonly known as 'nobile-type.' Some species in the section are strongly deciduous but many, including nobile, moniliforme, and other important hybrid ancestors often retain their leaves for several years depending on how they're grown.

How you have it potted looks good, moss in clay works well for these IMO. If it's moss all the way through you might want to add something like styrofoam peanuts or lava rock to keep things a little airier, though I'm guessing by your comment about sphag packed in the roots that you've already figured that out.

[NYCorchidman]

I would say this is a nobile type, a hybrid. They do not lose leaves and can maintain for years as long as the winter temperature does not fall below 50 or so.

I see some old dried up spikes ( cut off and gone) on a few of the nodes of older canes.

Dendrobiums in general make tons of roots. With that many canes on your plant, I wouldn't be surprised if I used a larger pot, but of course, pot size should go with the root mass and no one here can tell but you.

[ramonypony]

Originally Posted by gnathaniel

Nice plant! It looks like a hybrid in section Dendrobium (of genus Dendrobium), more commonly known as 'nobile-type.' Some species in the section are strongly deciduous but many, including nobile, moniliforme, and other important hybrid ancestors often retain their leaves for several years depending on how they're grown.

How you have it potted looks good, moss in clay works well for these IMO. If it's moss all the way through you might want to add something like styrofoam peanuts or lava rock to keep things a little airier, though I'm guessing by your comment about sphag packed in the roots that you've already figured that out.

Okay, so do you think it needs a winter rest?
I would never used sphagnum all the way through! It doesn't like me. I used lava rock, smallish bark, chc, perlite and some sphagnum in the top 1/3. It was in fine bark and perlite except for that moss ball. I can't find fine bark around here for the life of me so I just used a little bit of everything. This is my first dendrobium and I don't really know what I'm doing.

---------- Post added at 10:33 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:24 PM ----------

Originally Posted by HighSeas

Thanks for posting this thread! I've been wanting to learn more about Dendrobiums myself. I only have a few, most given to me....and I have NO earthly idea how to grow them even though I've read about "winter rests". What's confusing is that there are different types of Dends and different culture. I do have two getting ready to bloom...and I have NO idea how I lucked up on that!

It certainly wasn't "skill" or even that I "almost" knew what I was doing!

Haha! I hope I can get this one to bloom. When I got it I just crammed it into a tiny space in one of my East windowsills and watered it sometimes and it grew new growth like mad. Then I moved it outside and it's been doing well out there, too. Seems like the more I neglect this orchid the better it does.

[NYCorchidman]

The mix you are using sounds great.
Moss is not good for this one. It need a lot of watering (almost daily given great drainage) during the summer growth period and high light. I grow mine under direct sun only filtered by window glass.

You can grow fine with cattleya though.

Very important, stop fertilizing by July, otherwise flowering will not be good.

Once you see canes mature ( no more leaves on top and canes fatten up), begin to reduce watering a little.

Cold winter (not freezing) brings out the best flowering in the early spring, but if you don't have cold room or garage, try and find a place where you can keep these at least as cool as 60 or 55. Then you should still have good flowering with these.

[gnathaniel]

Originally Posted by ramonypony

Okay, so do you think it needs a winter rest?
I would never used sphagnum all the way through! It doesn't like me. I used lava rock, smallish bark, chc, perlite and some sphagnum in the top 1/3. It was in fine bark and perlite except for that moss ball. I can't find fine bark around here for the life of me so I just used a little bit of everything. This is my first dendrobium and I don't really know what I'm doing.

I agree with NYCOM, sounds like a great mix for this plant if you can keep up with the watering. Sphagnum gets a bad rap, but it's invaluable for plants I want staying moist for extended periods without having to water them everyday. It also has an acid pH and related ability to suppress growth of many pathogens. Straight sphag in clay pots works great for these and many other orchids, but when the pot size gets above 3" dia I hedge my bets with a little extra drainage in the center.

NYCOM gave you good advice on seasonal cycle for this one, so I won't get (too) repetitive. I'd just add that while cool temps seem to be the primary cue to induce flowering, dryness and probably day length play some role as well. The upshot is that if you can't easily provide a few weeks period of cool nights, then drying the plant longer between watering and keeping it darker (blocking out all light) at night may help it bloom in warmer temps. Growing the plant well (bright light, lots of water, and moderate fertilizing) during the warm months will ensure the plant has adequate stored carbs to later spend on flowers. Completely dry winters as are often advocated for these are NOT necessary, though in my conditions some of the strongly deciduous species need to be kept drier than others to avoid problems.

NYCOM, I'd quibble over whether fertilizing needs to be stopped by July for good blooming. I know several people who fertilize species and hybrids of this type year-round and bloom them as well as anyone else, and for those who 'rest' them harder a commonly-cited N. Hemisphere date range is Thanksgiving to Valentine's Day (ie late-November to mid-February for those whose holidays are different). Keiki formation is IMO a lot more complex in cause than just nutrient availability, though fertilizer probably plays some role. Whatever your fertilizer schedule, using balanced feed with adequate Ca and Mg and keeping overall salt (TDS) concentrations low is generally best for most cultivated orchids.

[NYCorchidman]

Regarding the rest, many people mistake "dry rest" as bone dry. This is not only incorrect but harmful for the plants.

These plants, well, of course the natural species, still get plenty of water during the winter. They just don't get rain on a lot everyday as they do during the summer months.

I water them good during the winter. As mentioned above, I do let them dry in between not because it promotes flowering but in fear of hurting the roots.
This is also what is recommended by Yamamoto Dendrobiums.

Regarding fertilizing schedules, my info also comes from Yamamoto. By following the advice of those who made and grow these plants, all is good and safe.