Can you give my new catt a name

[PaphMadMan]

Originally Posted by CTB

Paph could you explain "no bifoliate cattleya or laelia stock influence, " I thought bifoliate meant two leaf. Thanks

Bifoliate does indeed mean two leaves. Many Cattleya species have this characteristic, but your flower does not seem to show any influence of ancestry from those species, in my opinion. Is your plant bifoliate?

The flower also doesn't show much influence of the 'Laelia' species (now considered Cattleya for hybrid registration) that often contribute to complex hybrid Catts, in my opinion.

My intent was to narrow down the identification to probably a 'Bc.' type hybrid descended primarily from monofoliate Cattleya species such as C. labiata and from Rhycholaelia (Brassavola) digbyana. I don't think a more precise identification is likely. I'm sorry if that intent was unclear.

[CTB]

Yes, it is bifoliate, there's where my confusion came in. Thanks

[CTB]

Does anyone have one, with a lip wide open and flaten like this one ,with fringe? I haven't seen anything even close to it. Thanks

[kavanaru]

the problem with this kind of complex hybrids, is that you do not always see the influence of all kind of plants involved. As Paph said, I do not see much influence of bifoliate Catleya (these have quite different flowers as the unifoliate ones) in that flower. However, since the plant is indeed bifoliate, it is obvious some of them would be involved...

I would also not discard the Laelia/Sophronitis involvement, for the same reasons mentioned above. Note that currently all Sophronitis and all southamerican Laelias are Cattleyas! (Laelia is kept only for the "Mexican" Laelias, e.g Laelia anceps)

as for the flat lip and fringe.. yes, there are many of them (keep in mind there are over 250 000 different hybrids, many many if not most of them in the Cattleya alliance)... Flat lip like this could be influence of Rhycholaelia digbyana but also of Cattleyas like aurea or dowiana or even walkeriana... the fringes, most probably the influence of Rhycholaelia digbyana...

[CTB]

Thanks, you have started a whole research project this morning that is very interesting. Can you tell me the parents of( Lc. Tainan City 'General', AM-OSROC, AM/AOS. ) I don't have any books to help me. Thanks again

[kavanaru]

Cattleya Tainan City = C. Royal Emperor x C. Waianae Sunset

The best way to check for Hybrids' parents is this link: The International Orchid Register / RHS Gardening Keep in mind that this site is kept pretty up-to-date *** and therefore due to the several changes in Genus mentioned above, the hybrid you ar elooking for is not Lc. anymore but just Cattleya (this will depends on the planst involved in this hybrid, as explained before). In the link, the best is to use only the Grex (name of the Hybrid) and let it do the rest of the work. You can also check the name of a hybrid, if you have the name of the parents..


***sometimes they are kept TOO up-to-date, causing a lot of troubbles and misunderstandings.. For example, names changes are done by taxonomists (well, tehy SHOULD be done ONLY y taxonomist, but you see the tendency in Orchid circles, that anyone thinks to be an expert and publish any rubbish and then, of course the publication is valid, even if wrong!). You can publish whichever name changes you think is applicable and, in the best cases, give the rational for it. Normally, it takes a while until the whole scientific society (I mean Taxonomists and Systematicists) accept a change and cosider it applicable and true (as per the current knowledge on the plant group). However, the RHS seems to forget this, and very often they implement changes which have been very recently published, causing a BIG mess for the horticulturist (in this case most of the orchid breeders are horticulturist and NOT taxonomists, or any related branch of the botany - no matter how much they want to be the Key Opinion Leaders for the Orchids Family)... For example, in the last few years, we had Laelias changing to Hadrolaelias then (or wa sit before?) to Sophronitis, and then (or was it earlier?) back to Laelias and then all together to Cattleya (even if many taxonomist do not agree with these changes!!).. all these cahnges were inmediatelly implemented by the RHS... you can imagine now the big mess with names.. almost nobody could follow them and keep the correct name on their hybrids...

[CTB]

You have been so helpful. I have enjoyed your photos and found one similar in looks to mine in question except maybe for size. Blc. (Ports of Paradise 'Green Ching Hwa') could mine be a Blc or Bc?