Hoticultural term for "Best Guess"?

[WhiteRabbit]

Originally Posted by andrew__

Ok thanks. It may have been aff I'd read about but just didn't look into the proper use of it. Maybe I'll just put (NOID) beside the name on the tag. Does the job as well as anything else would.

yeah - thats what I do - have some plants did not come with i.d. or i.d. has been lost - I have them identified with noid and then then name that I am pretty certain they are

[andrew__]

Old post I'm reviving (sorry!) but I think I found the original term I had been looking for but still don't know whether this would be an appropriate use for it. I just read on DendroBoard (and that was probably where I'd seen it in the first place):

from this post

...Peperomia cf. panamensis. This does not mean that his plant IS Pep. panamensis rather it means that Guido is not sure what it is but that it has similarities to the species, Pep. panamensis. Thats what the, "cf" is for. That means to compare the plant to the particular species.

Sometimes we also see, "aff." which means that the plant in question is related to a certain species but the person is not 100% positive they are one in the same.

Now aff. was discussed and shouldn't be used to describe two cultivars that look similar so ruling that out.

Wikipedia tells me that "In the system of binomial nomenclature, the use of "cf." similarly used to indicate that the species needs to be seen in context of its comparison to another, but by definition is not confirmed as the same. For example "Corvus cf. splendens" indicates "a bird similar to the House Crow but not certainly identified as this species"."

So in the example that Andrew posted above (Oncidium NOID aff. 'Sharry Baby') aff. was incorrect because 1 - not comparing a species and 2 - more specifically not comparing an unsubscribed species to a described species while waiting for it to be described.

Could you use Oncidium NOID cf. 'Sharry Baby'?

Wikipedia says (when you search for aff) "affinis ("related to") in biological nomenclature, to characterize undescribed taxa (see also cf)" - does this mean the two are basically interchangeable or is there a difference between the two and in what situation would you use cf. vs aff.? If there is a difference would it still not be appropriate to use cf. in this situation for similar reasons (sp. vs cv., described vs undescribed etc.)?

I don't really care about naming my plant anymore but now that I'm reading more about this I'd like to know more about it as well... but if at the end of the day I can label my plant Cymbidium NOID cf. Cymbidium Eastern Message x sinense 'Shunshu' that would be a bonus

[Andrew]

The meanings of c.f. (confer) and aff (affinis) are subtly different. aff refers to an organism that is considered to be a species in its own right but has not yet been described. As such it is named in reference to its closest relative until such time as it is described. c.f. is used when where an organism is looks like a species but is sufficiently different from the type species that there is uncertainty as to whether or not it falls within the normal range of species varation. ie it acts as a flag for an organism that could be a variant or could be a new species and is in need of research to determine what it is. If you like the difference between cf and aff is the strength of conviction.

Both are botanical terms and are usually applied to species, subspecies and varieties. I don't think it is appropriate to apply the terms to horticultural epithets. In your case I'd simply call it a NOID and and a description of the flower on the label, independant of the name to distinguish it from other NOIDs in your collection eg Den. NOID (yellow, purple labellum) or if you can definately see species in the parentage call it something like Den NOID (canaliculatum hybrid).

My main issue with people assigning NOIDs with registered names is that, when these plants get shared around to other people, the dubious name sticks. I've seen plenty of pictures of Dendrobium "kingianum" posted on web forums that are clearly either speciosum/tetragonum hybrids or, less, forgiveable hot/cold hybrids. Both the grower and the vendor that sold them are unaware the label is wrong.

[andrew__]

Originally Posted by Andrew

The meanings of c.f. (confer) and aff (affinis) are subtly different. aff refers to an organism that is considered to be a species in its own right but has not yet been described. As such it is named in reference to its closest relative until such time as it is described. c.f. is used when where an organism is looks like a species but is sufficiently different from the type species that there is uncertainty as to whether or not it falls within the normal range of species varation. ie it acts as a flag for an organism that could be a variant or could be a new species and is in need of research to determine what it is. If you like the difference between cf and aff is the strength of conviction.

Pretty much what I was expecting. Thanks