Watering/Feeding Indoor Mounted Cattleya Seedling

[Roberta]

Originally Posted by rbarata

Just a tought...instead of rotate the plant, isn't it possible to rotate the mount?

That would help with the orientation... but also, it looks to me like the most active growth is on the outside, when it should be against the mount. When I look at the photo of the plant in its pot, there two nice big new growths, and those are what should be against the mount. As long as it's getting moved, it should be closer to center vertically - the roots need a place to grow downward and attach, and the new growths along the rhizome need a place to grow upward.

This is a really common mistake, since it looks better this way... for now... and seems natural. But with the new growth away from the mount, as it grows it will march away from the mount into the air. Counter-intuitive to put the older, smaller grows on the outside.

If it grows well, this won't be tiny for long, C. intermedia is vigorous.

[galguibra]

Originally Posted by Roberta

That would help with the orientation... but also, it looks to me like the most active growth is on the outside, when it should be against the mount. When I look at the photo of the plant in its pot, there two nice big new growths, and those are what should be against the mount. As long as it's getting moved, it should be closer to center vertically - the roots need a place to grow downward and attach, and the new growths along the rhizome need a place to grow upward.

Originally Posted by Roberta

This is a really common mistake, since it looks better this way... for now... and seems natural. But with the new growth away from the mount, as it grows it will march away from the mount into the air. Counter-intuitive to put the older, smaller grows on the outside.

If it grows well, this won't be tiny for long, C. intermedia is vigorous.

Ohhhh wait I think I might've finally understood what you're saying now. In the original picture where it was still in the nursery pot, you can see the two pseudobulbs in the back with the bigger one slightly closer to the camera and more to the left, and then in front you can see the little baby leaves at the base of the seedling. Underneath is a newspaper with an orange weather map on the left side. Directly behind the pot, there's a piece of cardboard that says "with gram" on it (part of a cute little build-a-mini-calendar thing that came with my laptop to let you re-use part of the box!), and the flat face is more or less parallel to the face of the pot.


What I'm hearing is that if that cardboard were the mount, I should basically just slide the seedling on back so the pseudobulbs touch first, and then:

1. Rotate the whole plant 90° toward the side furthest from the little orange weather map on the newspaper (i.e., about the axis through the front/back faces of the pot) so that the pot would be on its side and opening toward the right, with the big leaves also going out toward the right with the concave openings pointing up toward the ceiling. At this point, the "line" of the rhizome is vertical and parallel to the mount, but the "bottom" of the rhizome is out in the air and facing toward the left wall.
   
2. Rotate the plant again, but this time 90° about the axis through the new "top" and "bottom" faces of the pot (formerly the left and right faces) so that it turns back out toward a front-facing observer and you end up with the leaves coming straight out of the mount and parallel to the floor with their openings still up toward the ceiling. At this point, the bottom of the rhizome is against the mount, and it's still vertical and parallel to the mount as well.

Is that what you mean? If so, I think I all I'd need to do is rotate the seedling 90° to the right in the same plane the base of the rhizome is currently sitting in. The plant looks a little bit different right now because it got shifted around during mounting and obviously gravity makes things sit differently, but I'm pretty sure the side of the plant with the rhizome is already right up against the mount

[Roberta]

Here are some photos of one of my plants (in this case C. sincorana, a miniature Cattleya) Note how the new growth (which is blooming) is oriented against the mount. In the 2nd photo you can see the prior new growth that bloomed in the past.

[estación seca]

Seedlings need to stay moist, in bright shade, and not be disturbed any more than necessary. I think you should leave it alone. It will figure out how to grow. Trying to move it again will damage more roots and set it back.

Many people have trouble growing mounted plants inside a house. The relative humidity is low, and it's hard to keep them moist. Tiny seedlings don't like to dry out. Fortunately C. intermedia is a sturdy plant, but any seedling that small is vulnerable.

If you're unable to keep it moist all the time, consider putting the whole thing into a large vase or glass jar. That will raise the humidity.

[Roberta]

Yes, if the plant has been there for awhile, leave it alone, it may be starting to established. If it was just mounted in the last few days, you still have the option of re-orienting. More than that, leave it.

[galguibra]

Okay, that makes sense yeah! I mounted it on Tuesday morning, but it does seem like some of the roots have already grown a bit and found their way into some crevices on the surface of the mount. I think at this point it's probably simpler to just leave it, but I really appreciate your patience in working through the positioning with me regardless All the better for my next mount someday! (definitely gonna let this one grow first and get some more experience first tho haha) As far as the water, I've been able to keep it pretty consistently moist so far, and after tweaking my humidifier set-up I've only had to spray it by hand maybe twice a day. The mist column is adjustable though—and it only turns on if the humidity is lower than 60%, and automatically turns off at 65%—so would it make sense to actually bathe it in vapor "cloud forest" style? Obviously would still want it to dry off to avoid risking rot, but it seemed like something that might be worth trying!


I've also been experimenting with spraying the fertilizer solution on the mount above/around the plant, so then when I mist it with the distilled water it'll get dilute trickles of nutrients over time rather than stronger bursts. I guess that could also help prevent build-up? Not sure if that would make a practical difference, but it occured to me that's probably kinda how they pick stuff up from rainwater runoff on their host trees and the concept got me thinking 🤔

[Roberta]

Originally Posted by galguibra

I've also been experimenting with spraying the fertilizer solution on the mount above/around the plant, so then when I mist it with the distilled water it'll get dilute trickles of nutrients over time rather than stronger bursts. I guess that could also help prevent build-up? Not sure if that would make a practical difference, but it occured to me that's probably kinda how they pick stuff up from rainwater runoff on their host trees and the concept got me thinking 🤔

Don't overthink this... yes, a microdose with each watering can be helpful - but not really necessary. Also, it really doesn't want to stay constantly wet - even once a day would be fine, and less than that for fertilizer. Fertilizer is the least important cultural factor - temperature, light, water, air movement are much farther up the list. Being a little seedling, you probably don't want it to stay dry TOO long, but drying out in the afternoon/evening and then getting a good bath in the morning, especially in a humid environment, should be plenty. Also, remember that when it cools off in the evening the humidity goes up (and therefore the evaporation of water slows down). (That's the "relative" part of relative humidity, cool air holds less water than warm air so for the same amount of water, the RH will be higher in the evening than at mid-day)

[galguibra]

That's a good point about the temperature! The humidifier display shows the humidity in real time, but I'm sure it's only so accurate, and the read-out is likely only representative of the area immediately near the air intake. Plus since I have my HVAC set to drop from 73 to 68 at night, the evaporation rate is definitely lower.


Also I'm still a bit confused about the wet-dry cycle: I understand that everything needs to dry off to avoid rot—and that the plant doesn't want to stay dry for too long or it'll be stressed and have to dip into pseudobulb reserves—but does it actually want/need an extended period of time every day where it stays dry? Like, in theory, are we shooting for making sure it gets just to the point of being all the way dry and that the velamen are nice and white and ready to absorb water again and then watering it whenever it gets to that point if possible, or would we want it to get dry and stay that way until it's watered again the next day, or that night or whatever the case may be?


Bonus content: I just checked, and both pseudobulbs have put out brand new roots!! There were already some pretty young roots when I got it, but sometime in the last four days since I mounted it it's even managed to put out ~3 new ones! It might just be my impression, but comparing with the earlier pictures it seems like the others might be a bit longer too. Exciting stuff

[Roberta]

It sounds like a happy plant! Being a seedling, the wet-dry cycle needs to be gentler than it would be for a mature plant. But Cattleyas in general do want some drying, more than most other groups. Those big, fat pseudobulbs on a mature plant are there as sources of reserve water and nutrients. Epiphytic orchids in general want "humid air" more than "wet" in the root zome, but the amounts vary - Oncidiums and Cymbidiums don't want to ever dry out, but they do need air around their roots, hence a medium that has air spaces like bark. (And need repotting as it breaks down and gets "muddy") Phalaenopsis like some drying, but with high humidity so they don't stay dry for long. The Cattleya group likes the "dry" part to be drier. This is all a matter of degree, of course, With experience (and more plants...remember we're all enablers here ) you'll get the feel of it. If you can manage clubs and shows, you're learning rate will increase. But no matter how much of other people's experience you can draw upon, their conditions are never going to be identical to yours, you'll need to put those tidbits into context. Keep on asking questions! It's the answers to "Why?" that let you apply the information to your own situation.

[galguibra]

Originally Posted by Roberta

It sounds like a happy plant! Being a seedling, the wet-dry cycle needs to be gentler than it would be for a mature plant. But Cattleyas in general do want some drying, more than most other groups. Those big, fat pseudobulbs on a mature plant are there as sources of reserve water and nutrients. Epiphytic orchids in general want "humid air" more than "wet" in the root zome, but the amounts vary - Oncidiums and Cymbidiums don't want to ever dry out, but they do need air around their roots, hence a medium that has air spaces like bark. (And need repotting as it breaks down and gets "muddy") Phalaenopsis like some drying, but with high humidity so they don't stay dry for long. The Cattleya group likes the "dry" part to be drier. This is all a matter of degree, of course, With experience (and more plants...remember we're all enablers here ) you'll get the feel of it. If you can manage clubs and shows, you're learning rate will increase. But no matter how much of other people's experience you can draw upon, their conditions are never going to be identical to yours, you'll need to put those tidbits into context. Keep on asking questions! It's the answers to "Why?" that let you apply the information to your own situation.

That makes sense! Having a little seedling to get to baby and fuss over has definitely scratched an itch. Seeing the new roots coming in definitely put me a bit more at ease, but figuring out what I can do to make my plants happy and diving into the research to tinker with all the nitty-gritty variables has always been a big part of the fun for me


I'll have to try and pace myself with getting anything new before I suddenly wake up and find myself living in a rainforest, but then again that does sound kinda nice


Orchids do also happen to be my partner's favorite flower—he goes GOOFY for the purple ones especially, which is why I made sure to hunt down a coerulea form—so if anything, making a few additions to the collection can go under the "making my bf smile" budget


I was actually looking into Vandas as a potential option, especially since lots of them naturally have blue/purple flowers! I've heard they need a LOT of light, but I have two extra grow lights sitting around at the moment that can do ~25k lux/~600 PPFD at 12", so I figure I could at least support a strap-leaf variant in a hanging basket, if nothing else