Warm and Hot Cymbidiums - a reference

[JScott]

Originally Posted by Roberta

JScott -
Just looked up Cym Milton Carpenter... one parent is Cym. Golden Elf... so odds are good that it will work for you... likely bloom time, I suspect, will be late summer/early fall. If you can get your hands on it, also consider Cym Chen's Ruby, which also has Golden Elf as one parent...I have that one, and it blooms around September/October, so clearly doesn't need the cool-down. Fragrant too. (Golden Elf itself can bloom for me as early as August)

Thanks so much for the tips! If Milton Carpenter blooms for me, I'll definitely look into getting the ones you mentioned, and research others with Golden Elf as a parent. Thanks so much.

[Roberta]

Originally Posted by isurus79

Mary Mancini in Louisiana came and spoke to us a few years ago about the warm growing Cyms she grows. I think if she can bloom them in LA, they can take any heat we throw at them!

Heat isn't the problem with Cyms... with the exception of a few Asian species, they can pretty much all tolerate triple digits F. The challenge is to get them to bloom, since most require an autumn cool-down to set spikes. Otherwise they do what JScott's did... grow like weeds with no flowers. the so-call "heat-tolerant" ones have been bred to not need that cool-down to bloom. Clearly some are more successful than others in that department. I'm strongly suspecting that the late summer/early fall bloomers would be the most forgiving, since they bloom either in, or immediately after, the hottest part of the year, obviously don't need "cool" to bloom.

[isurus79]

Originally Posted by Roberta

Heat isn't the problem with Cyms... with the exception of a few Asian species, they can pretty much all tolerate triple digits F. The challenge is to get them to bloom, since most require an autumn cool-down to set spikes. Otherwise they do what JScott's did... grow like weeds with no flowers. the so-call "heat-tolerant" ones have been bred to not need that cool-down to bloom. Clearly some are more successful than others in that department. I'm strongly suspecting that the late summer/early fall bloomers would be the most forgiving, since they bloom either in, or immediately after, the hottest part of the year, obviously don't need "cool" to bloom.

Are there non fall bloomers then? I obviously don’t know much about this group! Lol

[Roberta]

Originally Posted by isurus79

Are there non fall bloomers then? I obviously don’t know much about this group! Lol

I'd expect there are quite a few. There has been a lot of work done to breed "warmth-tolerant" Cyms that have the form of the the standard Cyms but don't need the cool-down to bloom. Once shows get going again, I think there's an outfit in Florida who is selling some, developed by New Horizon Orchids. I don't know a lot about that group of hybrids... since I live in "Cymbidium heaven" - they get the weather pattern that they crave naturally - the only ones that I can be sure (based on experience) don't need the fall cool down are the ones that bloom for me right after summer. I also suspect that the really late ones (like Cym Kuranda, blooming in a few weeks), which have warm-growing parents might also not need the cool-down, but I can't be sure because they get it anyway. With those summer/fall bloomers, the late spring bloomers, and the range of "normal" ones that bloom at various times over the late winter and early spring, I only have about 2 months or less that are Cymbidium-less.

[Cym Ladye]

Cym Kusuda Shining, a Golden Elf hybrid, Peter Pan and their progeny are early bloomers and have heat tolerance. Golden Elf and Peter Pan both go back to the fall blooming species ensifolium.

[SaraJean]

Originally Posted by Roberta

(I HATE the term "warmth tolerant", essentially all Cyms can handle heat, its "warm muggy nights tolerant" that counts)

Finally! Someone who understands!


This is the info I need.

[DirtyCoconuts]

Also known as “Florida” lol

[JScott]

Originally Posted by Cym Ladye

Cym Kusuda Shining, a Golden Elf hybrid, Peter Pan and their progeny are early bloomers and have heat tolerance. Golden Elf and Peter Pan both go back to the fall blooming species ensifolium.

Kusuda Shining was one of the parents of one of the plants I got from Odom that never bloomed. I don't remember the other parent. I know I have that information stored somewhere (the parentage of all three plants), but I would have to look for it.

I had Cym Valentine's Love, which has Peter Pan as one of its parents. I never got the chance to see if it would bloom again (it was in spike when I bought it in August). It got some sort of bacterial rot that apparently started in the rhizome, and it spread fast. Literally one day the plant looked fine, and the next day the leaves were turning yellow and falling off, except on the newest growth. I cut the plant up to see if there was anything worth saving, but the brown line running through the rhizome went all the way to the newest growth (although the roots seemed fine, the pbulbs were brown and squishy), and as virulent as this disease seemed to be, I figured I'd better get it out of my collection as soon as possible, so it was disposed of. That was my last Cymbidium attempt until I bought Milton Carpenter last year. I really liked Valentine's Love, and if I can get Milton to bloom, I'll probably look for Valentine's again.

[Cym Ladye]

If the hybridizer is not breeding for heat tolerance, the other parent may not carry the necessary genetic makeup and hence reduce the ensifolium influence to a mere 25%. Breeding for early fall bloomers and for heat tolerance do not always go together.

[Keysguy]

Hah......... I just woke up! All this talk of the Milton Carpenter Cymbidium........he was the gentleman that owned Everglades Orchids I mentioned earlier and whose name I couldn't recall. DUH!

Here's a snipit I found on his hybridizing success in search of "warmth tolereant" Cymbidiums.

"Over the years, we have attempted well over 15,000 hybrids. From that, we've obtained about 3,000 pods. That means that 20% of the pods did take. Of those 3,000 pods, the majority of them did not produce viable seeds. I believe we have named 504 hybrids out of those 3,000 pods. With this type of hybridizing within the Oncidiinae, you run into sterility barriers due to the different groups and genera. Sometimes they simply won't match up - and then if you do get something, it's often a mule - you can't go any further with it. So you have to make a lot of hybrids to find a few that are successful -- those that will give you a good plant and allow further hybridization."