Walkeriana 'pendentive'

[No-Pro-mwa]

Very interesting. I was just thinking the other day about this. And was wondering if way, way back allot of orchids were crossed, naturally of course and we will never know. Something to ponder I guess. For now I will just simply enjoy the blooms.

[isurus79]

Originally Posted by Anglo

Yeah, I was a bit disappointed to learn about this also. I had actually read about the parentage of 'Estrela da Colina' and Dayane Wenzel' a few years earlier in a little article or extract by Charles Keller, Rio de Janeiro. He explained that they are siblings from the same cross between an unnamed selfing of 'Orchidglade' and a C. walkeriana v. tipo.

Anglo,
Is there any way you can find this article? Or point me in the correct direction? I'd love to read it. My understanding is that 'Orchidglade' is a true, wild collected walkeriana and that 'Pendentive' was the result of selfing the wrong plant (i.e. a dolosa). The selfing was then wrongly attributed to 'Orchidglade.'

[Anglo]

Originally Posted by isurus79

Anglo,
Is there any way you can find this article? Or point me in the correct direction? I'd love to read it. My understanding is that 'Orchidglade' is a true, wild collected walkeriana and that 'Pendentive' was the result of selfing the wrong plant (i.e. a dolosa). The selfing was then wrongly attributed to 'Orchidglade.'

Hi, Steve. Here's the pertinent part of it. It's from a Brazilian web site that I happened across in December 2016. I saved a machine translation of the text below at that time as a reference. I did not save the URL, and don't know if the page is still on the internet. If it is, I can't find it now.


Cattleya walkeriana 'Estrela da Colina'

by Charles Keller
Rio de Janeiro - RJ
carlosgkeller@terra.com.br

This beautiful Cattleya walkeriana has large flowers and a shimmering glow. Recently, I believe that in 2005, the AOS judges visited the Hall of Walkerianas in Rio Claro and conferred the awards to this clone of High Commended Certificate. She is the sister of Cattleya walkeriana type 'Dayane Wenzel' a crossing that is originated [(C.walkeriana v.alba 'Orchidglade' x self) C.walkeriana v.tipo x 006]. This flower live is much more beautiful than in this picture and is a very common phenomenon in this species. In C. walkeriana, photos very deceiving...


I'm not entirely sure who Charles Keller is, but I've seen his name here and there while searching through Brazilian orchid sites. Since his email is / was at terra.com.br, maybe he is in some way associated with Orchideas Terra
( Orquideas Terra ). And maybe not. Terra.com.br is not an orchid site.

As for 'Orchidglade' being a true walkeriana, at least one orchid expert I know of insists that it is, but I don't think so. I have another article, pasted below in its entirety, about 'Orchidglade' and 'Pendentive' for you or anyone interested in reading it. This was translated from Japanese to Portuguese and then to English. The English translation was obviously not done by a native speaker of English, which would account for the faulty verbiage here and there (such as "...when he met Yuki Suzuki and made her naked seen" in the third paragraph). I haven't done any editing. It's all as I found it.


In the PLAY magazine, the Japan Orchids Grower Association, vol. 4 autumn-summer of 2003, Yuki Suzuki recounts his experiences in crosses of C. walkeriana var. alba Pendentive "and also other C. walkeriana alba that were released in the United States over the past thirty years.

In our view, this article represents a positive contribution to the subject, about which much is heard, but it lacks a more reasoned analysis that enables us to more objective conclusions. For this reason, we hope that the work of Yuki Suzuki serve as an example for other contributions will be presented to the world and orquidójilo orchidologist.

Mark Reeves, in 1980, was in the town of Mishima in Japan during the Summer Festival, when he met Yuki Suzuki and made her naked seen.

Reeves, an orchid grower, was then a young American, who lived in Miami, Florida and at that time was President of the South Florida Orchid Socicty (SF05). Currently Father, Mark Reeves, a devout Catholic, no longer cultivates orchids and works in the Vatican. He left the orchid world an important contribution in the C. walkeriana var. alba Pendentive. By the time he visited Yuki Suzuki, cultivated the "Pendentive" on the cork and sold their plants to nurseries and collectors, which allowed him to make the travel intemacionais.

In 1977, a plant got 85 points and an Award of Merit by the American Orchid Society (AOS). Today there are many mentioned and cuts of the original plant around the world.

The origin of this plant has been much discussed, as well as its authenticity as true C. walkeriana. It can be about a hybrid natural or artificial, made so on purpose or by mistake, and by presenting different characteristics, has been the reason of the suspicions raised.

Yuki recebcu this plant Reeves in the 70s. In bloom, Yuki realized she was different from C. walkeriana.
Even then, it was known in Japan, C. dolosa. Comparing the flower, narrow passages, the seeourtom "Pendentive" was different and distinct, natural or not, was a very attractive flower.

Mark Reeves acquired C. walkeriana alba Pendentive "in the 70's, the firm of Fred. Stewart, based in San Gabriel, California-in the United States. At that time, Stewart has made many crossings, siblings of C. walkeriana seedlings and sold them provenicntcs

C. walkeriana "Pendentive" In April 1977, the exposure of OSA, the judges doubted the authenticity of C. Willful and "Pendentive. There was much discussion on the subject take, thinking that the judges "Pendentive" would be a C. dolosa. Even in doubt, the plant received 85 points classification c AM/AOS.

Califómia has good weather for growing C. walkeriana. Even so, the plants of the variety alba have less resistance and therefore greater difficulty of cultivation, which requires, therefore, selected arrays.

In 1974, the cultivar called "Perfect Charm" was awarded. Already in 1978, another cultivar, called "Diamond Bright" was also awarded. They all drew attention because it represents success in the selection of matrices, coming from Stewart, coming from a single mother, "Orchidglade" after successive generations.

Flowers alba crazy left the orchid. Cultivars "Perfect Charm" and "Diamond Bright" seedlings are coming from the same intersection.

On his visit to the nursery Stewart, in 1980, Yuki remembers that there were enough seedlings of C. walkeriana var. alba.

In 1965 he was made a selfing of cultivar Orchidglade ", which Yuki believes that it is a natural hybrid. After that, other crosses between plants sisters were made, hence the "Pendentive.

Some say that the "Pendentive" is a natural plant, but Yuki Suzuki believes it was established that plant produzidapor Stewart.

The "Orchidglade" was premiadaem l960 by American Orchid Society. Yüki believes that all of their hybrid offspring

In early 1990, Jonny & ScuIly, established in Miami, Florida and considered the largest commercial nursery in the world, was shut down. The famous C. walkeriana var. alba Orchidglade "was considered its main product.
Many wanted more information on the two previous generations of "Pendentive", ie, the "Orchidglade.
Robert Scully Jr., who currently resides in Saragossa, he was visited by Yuki, who talked with him by any chance talked about the "Orchidglade and with doubts about it, he said it had been made self-fertilization, resulting in few seedlings in flasks.

Haviamuitos interested in acquiring them.
Stewart bought from Johnny & Scully only two bottles. The catalog of the firm Jonny & Scully looked more like a dictionary, there were so many plants, however C. walkeriana "Orchidglade" did not appear there. In 1970, each plant was sold at $150. However, at the time that Stewart bought was much more expensive. Yuki doubt the price, which in their opinion, should have been much larger at the time.

Each year, the seedlings were exported to Japan, where there were enough seedlings for sale. One, called "Yuki San", won award AM-AJOS in Japan This plant
But already died. Currently few plants are still available in Japan

On the "Orchidglade"

The first to have the "Orchidglade" was Mr. Robert M. Scully, who knew a Brazilian, named Ely Uores, a seller of orchids and, if still alive, would have more than 100 years old. Would c. walkeriana "Orchidglade" he who sold him the first generation of "Orchidglade.

Yuki says he does not know much about Ely. Just what would a person suspected to have collected the plant in the wild. Yuki has information that in Brazil it would be considered a bad character (bad guy). There are rumors that this plant had been stolen in the Botanical Garden of Rio de Janeiro, which Yuki thinks founded, since there is no record about it. But he does not doubt that the "Orchidglade" was collected long ago, in their natural habitat. It has the characteristics of a C. wallceriana pure reason was classified as FCC AOS.

The "Pendentive" is the second generation "Orchidglade. Yuki believes that "Orchidglade" is a hybrid that, over several generations, passed through various mixtures. For example, if from a region of Brazil, which also occurs in C. loddigesii, may have resulted from a natural hybrid cross posterionnente several times with C. walkeriana and then with C. loddigesii, prevailing characteristics of C. walkeriana.

This process may have occurred by chance over millions of years, after which it may have been found by someone who, chando be a C. walkeriana pure, may have sold it and made money. Even for scientists it is difficult to have confirmation of this hypothesis. In Kyucho Island, southern Japan and the islands have a few natural hybrids. In Thailand, the same happens with Paphios. This represents good examples of the phenomenon analyzed. Also in Brazil these problems occurred with C. walkeriana.

Yuki said that the Faculty of Agriculture Gifu conducted laboratory studies very interesting about the DNA of the Cattleya, in which we observed close proximity between the groups of C. walkeriana type, coerulea and semi-alba. Only the alba as "Pendentive", "Perfect Charm" and "Orchidglade" stood in another group, separate from the first and is shown next to the "Angel Walker" or "Obreiniana. The outcome has been reached, suggests that the Pendentive "is the same breed of" Orchidglade "third generation and Yuki would think to confirm this. Regrets are not available to cultivate more "Orchidglade" original to them for testing.

The "Orchidglade" and "Pendentive" may even be hybrids. There is no denying that they are not mixed with other species. Yuki regrets not having knowledge of the studies cited by the College, which could shed some light on the origin of C. walkeriana "Orchidglade. And great interest in Pendentive "based on the quality of your flower.
In finna Jonny & SculIy the first crosses of "Orchidglade" appear in their catalog with the number 1550: C. "Angel Walker, C. "Little Angel" and C. "June Delight".

The "Orchidglade" presents flowers to the width of the flowers of C. loddigesii. Yuki concludes that this explains their greater proximity to the group. In your opinion, DNA testing shows that are very close.

In C. "Angel Walker" this feature is very strong and very prevalent in later generations. This detail gives it great valorização. Atualmente is evident fondness for the original plans and "Pendentive" is not taken into account in the trials. However, lay people flock to this plant.

[isurus79]

Wow, this is incredibly valuable information! Thank you so much for posting!

I figure I should also point to a 2010 thread where Harry Akagi (H&R Nurseries cofounder, walkeriana guru, and all round good guy) posts additional discussion regarding 'Pendentive.' C. walkeriana (not) ‘Kenny’

Isn't Yuki Suzuki the same person who conducted the DNA study that Harry mentioned in the 2010 thread is not valid?

Evandro Tambrussi (Brazil) recently published an additional DNA study regarding 'Pendentive.' I can provide that if you haven't read it.

[Anglo]

Originally Posted by isurus79

I figure I should also point to a 2010 thread where Harry Akagi (H&R Nurseries cofounder, walkeriana guru, and all round good guy) posts additional discussion regarding 'Pendentive.' C. walkeriana (not) ‘Kenny’.

Yes, that was great info. Harry (Catwalker808) had tons of great info, but hasn't posted anything here for a long time. I wish he'd come back.

Originally Posted by isurus79

Isn't Yuki Suzuki the same person who conducted the DNA study that Harry mentioned in the 2010 thread is not valid?

Could be, but I don't know who conducted that study.

Originally Posted by isurus79

Evandro Tambrussi (Brazil) recently published an additional DNA study regarding 'Pendentive.' I can provide that if you haven't read it.

Sure! Can you post it here? That would an excellent addition to this thread, in my opinion.

[isurus79]

I'll try to see if I can post a PDF on this site. If not, I might have convert it to JPEGs.

---------- Post added at 12:24 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:17 PM ----------

Or I'll just post a link to the website! Basically, Orchidglade, Kenny, and Pendentive are more genetically distant to wild walkeriana than they are to known hybrids. Its small study that should lay the ground work for future, larger studies.

http://www.scielo.br/pdf/asagr/v39n3...9-03-00315.pdf

[Anglo]

Originally Posted by isurus79

I'll try to see if I can post a PDF on this site. If not, I might have convert it to JPEGs.

---------- Post added at 12:24 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:17 PM ----------

Or I'll just post a link to the website! Basically, Orchidglade, Kenny, and Pendentive are more genetically distant to wild walkeriana than they are to known hybrids. Its small study that should lay the ground work for future, larger studies.

http://www.scielo.br/pdf/asagr/v39n3...9-03-00315.pdf

Excellent -- thanks!