Enc. mooreana temperature - Why there are no experts

[D_novice]

Well, maybe there are experts - but the ones Google finds don't seem to agree. Hmm, reminds me of every other issue in orchid-land!!

Does E mooreana grow cool, intermediate, warm?

Cool to cold: IOSPE PHOTOS

Warm: Encyclia mooreana - Cattleya Source

This one I'm including just to demonstrate how easy it is to sleazily plagiarize on the web. Note that this blog post (no copyright on the blog, hmmmm....) is from 2010, and it is an exact verbatim copy of the catt wikidot page above, which was updated in 2008. It doesn't matter what this says since whoever has this site apparently has nothing original to say and doesn't have the decency to cite their source or admit they are plagiarizing.Cattleya Orchid Source: Encyclia mooreana
But I digress....

warm: Encyclia mooreana | Orchids Wiki | Fandom powered by Wikia

Cold, Cool, and Warm - no votes for intermediate LOL!

Anyone have the book on Encyclia? Or spent a lot of time in a cloud forest in Central America between 270 and 2100 meters? The fact that this plant can live at nearly 7000 feet makes me trust the "cool to cold" a little more; but at under a 1000 feet, warm seems likely.

Maybe this is one of those warm to cold growers, and that is the reason for the confusion/disagreement.

[estación seca]

I'm just deducing; I haven't grown anything called Encyclia mooreana. Note this from IOSPE:

This species is a part of the Encyclia oncidioides complex and most likely is a synonym of it along with, Enc [sic] gravida, Enc guatemalensis, Enc stellata, and Enc guianensis.

E. oncidioides is shown on IOSPE as a hot to warm grower from low elevations. It was on the Andys Orchids Web site in late November 2016 when I bought it, and now it's in spike! It's not listed there now, but here is the text that was on the page:

Spring, Summer Blooming
Bright; 2500-3500 Footcandles (very bright indirect light)
Intermediate to Warm; 58°F min. to 88°F max.
Dry/Moist; 2-3 waterings per week (let dry between waterings)

Cloud forests are cool to cold, and dripping wet, when it's cloudy during the day, and almost every night. In some areas they are sunny and warm during the day. In other areas they're cool to cold, cloudy and dripping wet most to all of the time.

Following is a link to a page with listings of the type description, as well as the type descriptions of other species now considered the same. You could look up the places on a map and get an idea of what the terrain is like, and then you could look up the climate.
EPIDENDRA .:. Encyclia mooreana

Tropicos gives a list of herbarium specimens of this plant with detailed collection coordinates for each specimen. You again could look them up on a map.
Tropicos | Name - Encyclia mooreana (Rolfe) Schltr.

Finally, digging deeper into the search results, you can find E. mooreana listed for sale in old Ecuagenera lists. They show it as warm growing.

In the US all material is copyright by the author, whether or not a copyright notice or symbol is included.

[PaphMadMan]

I'm not an Encyclia expert, but I have excellent sources. For comparison to a what most consider a typical Encyclia, based on actual habitat climate data - E. cordigera gets average highs about 90F and average lows about 63F - while E. mooreana gets average highs of 70F and average lows of 50F. I'd definitely call E. mooreana a cool grower. It can probably take warm days but it probably needs those cool nights to thrive if it does.

[Ray]

Let us also not ignore the fact that a single species may very well have several different population ranges, and some may have adapted to different - in this case warmer - conditions than others.

[orchidsarefun]

Originally Posted by Ray

Let us also not ignore the fact that a single species may very well have several different population ranges, and some may have adapted to different - in this case warmer - conditions than others.

I think that decades of propagation and selection, as well as the use of chemical compounds to change ploidy, must have had an impact. Basically all commercial growers want to move the dial so that plants can be grown in "average" conditions and not at either extreme - it's a bigger market.
I doubt that many of today's "improved" species would survive or thrive in their natural environment.

Sent from my LG-H901 using Tapatalk

[Subrosa]

Originally Posted by orchidsarefun

I think that decades of propagation and selection, as well as the use of chemical compounds to change ploidy, must have had an impact. Basically all commercial growers want to move the dial so that plants can be grown in "average" conditions and not at either extreme - it's a bigger market.
I doubt that many of today's "improved" species would survive or thrive in their natural environment.

Sent from my LG-H901 using Tapatalk

In the case of plants that are well established this is almost certainly the case, but many orchids simply haven't been numerous, desirable, or maybe just lucky enough to have received that sort of attention. This plant sounds like an example of the latter.

[isurus79]

Ya, I'm not aware of Encyclia mooreana being popular enough to warrant long term improvement or polyploidy. The listed temps make this species seems as though it would grow just fine with normal room temperatures.

[D_novice]

Originally Posted by estación seca

E. oncidioides is shown on IOSPE as a hot to warm grower from low elevations. It was on the Andys Orchids Web site in late November 2016 when I bought it, and now it's in spike! It's not listed there now, but here is the text that was on the page:

Spring, Summer Blooming
Bright; 2500-3500 Footcandles (very bright indirect light)
Intermediate to Warm; 58°F min. to 88°F max.
Dry/Moist; 2-3 waterings per week (let dry between waterings)

Cloud forests are cool to cold, and dripping wet, when it's cloudy during the day, and almost every night. In some areas they are sunny and warm during the day. In other areas they're cool to cold, cloudy and dripping wet most to all of the time.

Following is a link to a page with listings of the type description, as well as the type descriptions of other species now considered the same. You could look up the places on a map and get an idea of what the terrain is like, and then you could look up the climate.
EPIDENDRA .:. Encyclia mooreana

Tropicos gives a list of herbarium specimens of this plant with detailed collection coordinates for each specimen. You again could look them up on a map.
Tropicos | Name - Encyclia mooreana (Rolfe) Schltr.

Finally, digging deeper into the search results, you can find E. mooreana listed for sale in old Ecuagenera lists. They show it as warm growing.

In the US all material is copyright by the author, whether or not a copyright notice or symbol is included.

Post a photo of the plant, please. Curious if it looks like mine. And I will post too if I can.

Thanks for the great references! Can't say I put much confidence in the ecuagenera, single word "warm" - hard to tell if that was just a field they had to fill, or if any thought went into it.

I think this overall thread is instructive. A plant found at this range of altitude could be cold to warm, though it's probably wet quite a bit (though we're told Encyclia like to dry out between waterings - and why have such nice round bulbs if water is ever-present?!) And, which characteristics does a given plant have? And, does an allied plant have the same characteristics? Maybe one is the lowland variety while another has a wider range...etc etc. Looking up the exact coordinates would kind of be guessing, I'd say - even though it might be interesting and ultimately educational.

The material is copyright the author. But the plagiarist is not the author.

My ultimate decision is to leave this plant outside for now, in an open small greenhouse, in the Northern California spring, which is cool and overcast lately. I'm new to Encyclia, but I have six of them out there, and two Alata/alata hybrids inside. Every plant is taking a chance when it comes to me!

And, the plant in question is a hybrid: E. mooreana x (E. mooreana x cordigera), from SLO orchids, on the Central California Coast SLO Orchids

[estación seca]

Ecuagenera has two growing sites. The warm growers are at the lower elevation site, where Cattleya maxima does well. They keep the cold and cool growers at the higher elevation site.

[PaphMadMan]

E. mooreana x E. cordigera is E. Standard Setter, and E. mooreana x E. Standard Setter is E. Isle of Skye. Even that 1/4 portion of E. cordigera probably means E. Isle of Skye will be perfectly happy in intermediate temps, even though E. mooreana may prefer it a bit cool.