C. dowiana var aurea - Page 2 - Orchid Board

gixrj18 · #11 03-21-2010, 01:47 PM

I quit playing the "identity game" a long time ago. I have found it hard to identify an orchid by small characteristics such as these, considering the diversity of these flowers. I have seen siblings that looked nothing like either parent. Because of this, I find it hard to say something is, or isn't a certain species, just because it does, or doesn't have a certain trait. Plus, it usually leads to an arguement....I guess I am as sure of this identity as I am of any of my orchids. Who am I to say.
So feel free to think of it as whatever is comfortable to you. To me, it is a beautiful flower, and the tag says C. dowiana. So that is what I'll call it. I hope that didn't come off sounding snotty, it wasn't meant to be. Just my

Orchidflowerchild · #12 03-24-2010, 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gixrj18

I quit playing the "identity game" a long time ago. I have found it hard to identify an orchid by small characteristics such as these, considering the diversity of these flowers. I have seen siblings that looked nothing like either parent. Because of this, I find it hard to say something is, or isn't a certain species, just because it does, or doesn't have a certain trait.

Yes, but species, being relatively stable genetic populations (by definition) do not have anywhere near as much potential for variation as a hybrid. There are just certain things that must be present, morphologically, for a flower to represent a member of that species population.

After all, species are often trying to attract specific pollinators, and the flowers have to attract those creatures, as well as be the right size and shape to effect pollination by said creatures. Which makes "little things" like lip shape, size, and markings crucially important, if not to you than certainly to the plant.

All of this is made moot by hybrid mudblood floof, of course.

-Cj

gixrj18 · #13 03-24-2010, 09:33 PM

Crucially important to plants in the wild. Most of these plants haven't seen the wild in many generations. They have been line bred in nice greenhouses, and haven't even seen a pollinator in eons. Everyone speaks like these plants just stopped evolving the day they were bred into captivity, and like there is just no way whatsoever that one of these extremely diverse plants could evolve a different trait here and there. I'm sorry, it just gets me how everyone thinks that just because a plant in the wild does certain things, that means that all of it's pampered descendants will always remain identical to the original one in the wild, even though they are living it up in a greenhouse. I think these plants have evolved way too much over the decades to think of them that narrow-mindedly......and I'm not calling anyone narrow-minded, I just think that would be a narrow-minded way to think of them. Ya know what I mean? Evolution is my only point here.

isurus79 · #14 03-24-2010, 09:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gixrj18

Crucially important to plants in the wild. Most of these plants haven't seen the wild in many generations. They have been line bred in nice greenhouses, and haven't even seen a pollinator in eons. Everyone speaks like these plants just stopped evolving the day they were bred into captivity, and like there is just no way whatsoever that one of these extremely diverse plants could evolve a different trait here and there. I'm sorry, it just gets me how everyone thinks that just because a plant in the wild does certain things, that means that all of it's pampered descendants will always remain identical to the original one in the wild, even though they are living it up in a greenhouse. I think these plants have evolved way too much over the decades to think of them that narrow-mindedly......and I'm not calling anyone narrow-minded, I just think that would be a narrow-minded way to think of them. Ya know what I mean? Evolution is my only point here.

I really don't see why you are fighting this so much. One of the greatest things about this site is that experts give their professional opinions on plants. In the professional opinion and experienced opinions of several members, this plant is not dowiana. I've had many plants that I thought was one thing and it turns out to be another. Not a big deal. I still enjoy these plants and now I am a little wiser when I pick out new ones! There are some VERY experienced people on this board (including on this very thread) and you dismiss them as though they don't have intimate knowledge of this very topic. Kinda rude.

kavanaru · #15 03-25-2010, 03:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gixrj18

Crucially important to plants in the wild. Most of these plants haven't seen the wild in many generations. They have been line bred in nice greenhouses, and haven't even seen a pollinator in eons. Everyone speaks like these plants just stopped evolving the day they were bred into captivity, and like there is just no way whatsoever that one of these extremely diverse plants could evolve a different trait here and there. I'm sorry, it just gets me how everyone thinks that just because a plant in the wild does certain things, that means that all of it's pampered descendants will always remain identical to the original one in the wild, even though they are living it up in a greenhouse. I think these plants have evolved way too much over the decades to think of them that narrow-mindedly......and I'm not calling anyone narrow-minded, I just think that would be a narrow-minded way to think of them. Ya know what I mean?

kind of YES and NO... Species are breed and improved (well, true most of the time, as some breedlines are not necessarily species improvements IMO) however, the species keep the "essence" of the species (due in bifg part to the intrinsic stability of the species per se). They can me "improved" but they are normally not "mutated" to something completely different (like your plant).

Anyway... you plant, your thing... you call it what you want... I think no one here in OB was intending to attack or offend you (or anyone else) when giving feedback on the right ID of a particular plant (or any other kind of feedback)... Basically, I thought that was the point of this forum, share experience and share knowledge: people experienced in one field give their opinion and share their knowledge... as Isurus, I also do not understand your point, but that's ok, as it is your point, and everybody has the right to have his/her own point...

Quote:

Originally Posted by gixrj18

Evolution is my only point here.

Evolution? in how many years? max in 100!!?? WOW!!! I am sorry to say this, but evolution can hardly be shown in such a short timeframe as the life of C. dowiana in USAmerican nurseries... on the other hand, under the influence of the human hand and cultural influence (talking about horticulture, and not about human culture!)... nope, I would not use that concept...

gixrj18 · #16 03-25-2010, 10:12 AM

I was not trying to be rude to anyone, and appreciate all comments.....and really don't care whether it's dowiana (or a hybrid). I was simply posting pics of a beautiful flower, and as I said at the beginning of the post....not looking for an arguement. I'm going to leave it at that, since this is obviously heading south.