C.coccinea in hybrid parentage

[greenhouseFrog]

During the meeting with my local society last night, the speaker(from northern Ohio)spent some time discussing how C.coccinea wouldn’t necessarily be a great choice for growers in southern Florida, so he didn’t bother bringing any for sale. That got my attention because while I don’t own a C.coccinea, I have a hybrid(Rth. Chief Glory ‘Red Ant’)that’s nearly half a C.coccinea and like 20 other species making up the rest of the background according to Orchidroots.

That hybrid(a bag baby and my first plant of the Cattleya alliance)was admittedly an impulse buy and the amount of research that went into it before I mounted it in the spring was minimal—I pretty much only looked up the parentage, confirmed it could bloom in shades of red or orange, and came to this ‘groundbreaker’ of a conclusion: if Cattleya=hot+bright and coccinea=red, then I should be good to go…high level thinking right there

Fast forward to now, and I’m still making uneducated impulse buys(see Maxillaria subsection), but I’d like to think my research has been getting better with time—I look at where the parents come from now and, if it exists, I’ll use the experience of others as a way to dial things in where I’m at.

Now with respect to that complex hybrid of mine with a lot of C.coccinea in the background: can I expect it to behave more like the C.coccinea because C.coccinea makes up the majority of the genetics or could another ancestor, despite making up a smaller slice of the genetic pie, be more dominant in what’s expressed? I might be experiencing the Mandela effect when I recall reading about C.coccinea being used to breed for smaller stature and red flowers, but if I’m not, then it seems like C.coccinea has some dominant traits, but I wonder if something invisible like temperature tolerance would be dominant or recessive or whether that tolerance is linked to something else entirely!

I just want a red Cattleya…

[Roberta]

Take a look at the Sunset Valley Orchids mini-Catts. Some gorgeous red ones. Most of those have been bred to be "windowsill orchids" that can grow over a wide range of conditions. They are all much less picky than the species C. coccinea. If you need additional guidance on a particular plant, Fred Clarke (the owner) is very willing to give you the information you need. Or just ask him which ones would do well for you.

[NatalieS]

My highschool biology level understanding of genetics would tell me that determining what is recessive and dominant is waaaayyyyy more complicated than we usually expect. While some genes are straightforwardly recessive or dominant, a lot of what is expressed genetically can actually be impacted by several different expressions on a DNA strand - and then scientists still get surprised by some new understanding of a sequence xD

If you want to do less experimenting, I'd be inclined to follow Roberta's suggestion.

If you want a temp-tolerant red catt, there is also ofc c. cernua - in my experience this little plant will take everything you throw at it.

[Roberta]

C milleri is also used in red hybrids. But in general, the hybrids are really forgiving. Natalie, you're very right, genetics is really complicated. That's where the hybridizer's knowledge and instinct comes it... it is an art as much as a science.

[NatalieS]

Knowledge, instinct, and plenty of patience!

[greenhouseFrog]

Thank you, Orchid Angels!

I’m going to pick Fred’s brain on this, but I need to word it as concisely as possible—he has been the champion of quick responses in my experiences writing to him and I’ve been inconsiderate of his time by writing novels to him instead of just the facts

Thanks again!

[Roberta]

How about "I am looking for a red Cattleya-tribe hybrid that will tolerate south Florida heat"?

If you prefer medium-size vs mini, state that too. (The red species tend to be little, but there are some intermediate-size hybrids that have the color)

[rbarata]

Have you considered C. "Zip"?
It's a cross of C. tenebrosa x C. milleri that should be good for Florida.

[greenhouseFrog]

Originally Posted by rbarata

Have you considered C. "Zip"?
It's a cross of C. tenebrosa x C. milleri that should be good for Florida.

I’ve considered it now! Roberta had mentioned the C. milleri hybrids and I can see why—that is vibrant!

[RJSquirrel]

he didnt say a bad choice.

these all have coccinea in them and grown in texas heat and regularly overwatered.



they cant be a good choice for everyone but I dont see any trouble for you growing these in southern fried florida.

good luck!!