The Long Awaited "Nun's Orchids"

[kavanaru]

Golden, your Cycnoches is gorgeous. You've gotten female flowers. That's the reason why they are not as brown as expected. Next year, give lots of light to the plant while growing, but when you see teh spikes starting to grow, move the plant to a place with less light. This should induce the production of female flowers.

[gixrj18]

Nice. Mine is outside now, in the sun, hoping to get females on the next three spikes. As these spikes faded, a fourth one started on Ctsm. integerrimum....it's bloomin' like crazy!

[golden]

Thank you Ramon.I will follow your advise next year.
One of my JEM hybrides is in spike now and I am very eager to see the flowers open.The weather is getting cold earlier this year and probably as a result of this the spike is growing quite slowly.

[Bruno De Toni]

Hi Jasen, I am new on this forum even though I was a frequent user as a visitor for the last two years. Then I decided to register today. Well the catasetum macrocarpum that you are showing is not really a macrocarpum, it looks very much alike to a xtapiriceps, a natural hybrid between macrocarpum and pileatum. It has a lot of macrocarpum but it is not that one. Look the labelum and you can see that are missing the three indenters which are considered the finger prints of the macrocarpum. The shape of the indenter in your labelum is similar to the xtapiriceps specimens that we have here in Venezuela. Do you have any idea where it comes from ?. If it comes from Venezuela I am pretty sure it is a xtapiriceps. As Ramon said before, here the macrocarpum is very common and also is very easy to mistake with xtapiriceps. By the way very nice specimens and very well kept

[Bruno De Toni]

Hi Jasen, I am new on this forum even though I was a frequent user as a visitor for the last two years. Then I decided to register today. Well the catasetum macrocarpum that you are showing is not really a macrocarpum, it looks very much alike to a xtapiriceps, a natural hybrid between macrocarpum and pileatum. It has a lot of macrocarpum but it is not that one. Look the labelum and you can see that are missing the three indenters which are considered the finger prints of the macrocarpum. The shape of the indenter in your labelum is similar to the xtapiriceps specimens that we have here in Venezuela. Do you have any idea where it comes from ?. If it comes from Venezuela I am pretty sure it is a xtapiriceps. As Ramon said before, here the macrocarpum is very common and also is very easy to mistake with xtapiriceps. By the way very nice specimens and very well kept.

[kavanaru]

Hola Bruno, bienvenido en OB glad to have you here!


I will have to disagree with your identification of this plant as Catasetum X tapiriceps.

The flowers of Catasetum X tapiriceps Syn. Cstm X splendens (I know, some people say that the second is Cstm macrocarpum x Ctsm imperiale, but that's only if you agree that Cstm imperiale is different than ctsm pileatum, which I do not do, as explained in another thread here), are resupinate as they are also those from Ctsm pileatum, but as Ctsm macrocarpum. Both flowers can be seen here:

IOSPE PHOTOS
IOSPE PHOTOS

Furthermore, I have to say that the flowers presented in this thread (Picture 1, right plant) are exactly like those Ctsm macrocarpum growing around my house in Venezuela, where we do not have populations of Ctsm pileatum (the nearest population of Ctsm pileatum that I know of is about 200 Km to the south - around the house of my grandparents - for those who have already read here, that I grew up surrounded by Ctsm pileatum and Cattleya violacea)

my

[Bruno De Toni]

Gracias por la bienvenida Ramon. Well going back to the matter of if it is a xtapiriceps or not, let me tell you that also myself I experimented such a disagreement some times ago, but after having the oportunity to see different flowers spikes as well as discussions with people that know much better than me these two species I can tell you that now there is a general consensus that if you do not find the trident shape in the cap or labelum it can not be considered a pure macrocarpum. I would like to insert some pictures to show the differences but I could not find the way. If you grew up in the area in which both catasetums are presents then you had the opportunity to find a huge spectrums of forms and shapes for the xtapiriceps, going from a very much alike to the pileatum shape in one extreme (as one of the pictures you showed) and going to the other extreme very much alike to macrocarpum, but with very slight differences in the labelum. This a subject that I really like and I am a catasetum fan since I was a child and I find these plants really interesting and fascinating. By the way I really like the Spledends name used long time ago rather than xtapiriceps, because they are really splendends. When I find the way to upload the pictures here I will show you what I meant. Thanks a lot for you reply.

[betoguerrero]

Ohhhhhhhhhh beautifull flowers.... is so strange!!!! Is the female flower so strange too???? it's beautifull but the plant is very delicate... I have one ... one day I change it from his place and it's going to die... so I have returned to that old place...
Congratulations!!!beautifull flowers with a difficult plant...

[kavanaru]

Originally Posted by Bruno De Toni

Gracias por la bienvenida Ramon. Well going back to the matter of if it is a xtapiriceps or not, let me tell you that also myself I experimented such a disagreement some times ago, but after having the oportunity to see different flowers spikes as well as discussions with people that know much better than me these two species I can tell you that now there is a general consensus that if you do not find the trident shape in the cap or labelum it can not be considered a pure macrocarpum. I would like to insert some pictures to show the differences but I could not find the way. If you grew up in the area in which both catasetums are presents then you had the opportunity to find a huge spectrums of forms and shapes for the xtapiriceps, going from a very much alike to the pileatum shape in one extreme (as one of the pictures you showed) and going to the other extreme very much alike to macrocarpum, but with very slight differences in the labelum. This a subject that I really like and I am a catasetum fan since I was a child and I find these plants really interesting and fascinating. By the way I really like the Spledends name used long time ago rather than xtapiriceps, because they are really splendends. When I find the way to upload the pictures here I will show you what I meant. Thanks a lot for you reply.

Hi Bruno, please if you have those pictures post them here. I am open to learn something everyday... I must admit, I have never heard of these discusions regarding the trident shape, but am really sure that around Guanare, there are no Ctsm pileatum to produce this hybrid, and the Ctsm. macrocarpum in this region have exactly the same labellum as the pictures posted here.
In central/south Apure, where we indeed have Ctsm pileatum, I must agree there is a huge variation within Ctsm macrocarpum, Ctsm X tapiriceps, and Ctsm pileatum. Not only in shape, but also in colours, which supports the idea that Ctsm pileatum var Imperiale is only a reflection of the pigmentation of Ctsm macrocarpum into the hybrids with very high percentage of Ctsm pileatum, which have more or less the same shape as this. (Note: Ctsm. pileatum is to be found in this region from perfect white, over cream with few spots to cream/white with lots of spots, and with luck also almost pure red flowers)

Guys, sorry for hijacking


Cool that you are also a Catasetum fan It was Ctsm. pileatum which hooked me into Orchids Glad to have another venezuelan, and at the same time catasetinae fan

[Royal]

Interesting discussion. Welcome Bruno, nice to have you here!