Questions about fertilizing Phalaenopsis

[bethmarie]

Originally Posted by bil

(Mossites are filthy pagan scum, but we must pity them)

I object! I'm clean, and I think filthy and scum are kind of redundant.

[bil]

Originally Posted by bethmarie

I object! I'm clean, and I think filthy and scum are kind of redundant.

My child. With phals the way of the Barkista is the only true path!

Mossites are known to practise unspeakable acts of depravity!

[Orchid Whisperer]

bil, I also count myself among the Barkistas (I prefer the less politically correct 'barkaholic')

However, having observed the growing habits of one particularly skilled mossite, that path can work, if you follow the path correctly and don't stray. A late friend potted many orchids, including some with notoriously rot-sensitive roots (Cattleya dowiana and the like) in long fiber sphagnum. The secrets: (1) He grew ONLY in a greenhouse, therefore had complete control over water, or withholding water. (2) he packed moss around the roots EXTEMELY tightly (I know - I had to un-pack several plants I purchased from him to move them from moss to bark or rock). (3) When he watered, it seems that he did so very lightly - the moss never seemed saturated, just moist. I think more water ran off of the moss, rather than through it. I have no idea how he managed flushing salts/solids out of the moss. I do know that the roots of his plants were always in excellent shape.

I grow outdoors more than half the year, with plants at the mercy of whatever weather comes along. For me, following the path of the mossite would be the road to perdition. I therefore remain a devout barkaholic.

[bil]

Originally Posted by Orchid Whisperer

bil, I also count myself among the Barkistas (I prefer the less politically correct 'barkaholic')

However, having observed the growing habits of one particularly skilled mossite, that path can work, if you follow the path correctly and don't stray. A late friend potted many orchids, including some with notoriously rot-sensitive roots (Cattleya dowiana and the like) in long fiber sphagnum. The secrets: (1) He grew ONLY in a greenhouse, therefore had complete control over water, or withholding water. (2) he packed moss around the roots EXTEMELY tightly (I know - I had to un-pack several plants I purchased from him to move them from moss to bark or rock). (3) When he watered, it seems that he did so very lightly - the moss never seemed saturated, just moist. I think more water ran off of the moss, rather than through it. I have no idea how he managed flushing salts/solids out of the moss. I do know that the roots of his plants were always in excellent shape.

I grow outdoors more than half the year, with plants at the mercy of whatever weather comes along. For me, following the path of the mossite would be the road to perdition. I therefore remain a devout barkaholic.

Well, reading that, I take my hat off to him. How the hell did he avoid suffocating the roots with the moss packed in tightly?

Like you, if I went down that path, I doubt my orchids would last long

[Ray]

Originally Posted by Orchid Whisperer

bil, I also count myself among the Barkistas (I prefer the less politically correct 'barkaholic')

WOW! You can't live without ME????

[Orchid Whisperer]

Originally Posted by Ray

WOW! You can't live without ME????

Of _COURSE_ not!! What would I do for fun???

[bethmarie]

Originally Posted by bil

My child. With phals the way of the Barkista is the only true path!

Mossites are known to practise unspeakable acts of depravity!

I deplore adding fuel to a discriminatory fire, but it would be less than truthful to not admit here that I've been moving my Phals from moss to bark over the last few weeks. I've grown in moss for years, and have happy healthy Phals, but can't help noticing that the ones I bring home from the greenhouse in bark have healthier roots by far.

Moss was a choice of overwhelm for me. I have too many plants that must be carted from the grow room to the kitchen for water, and the fewer days per week that happens, the better.

I decided to grow fewer plants and grow them as well as possible, and so must whittle down the collection over the spring. Hence, I am turning over a new leaf, the Phals are moving into bark, and I am hoping I don't kill them before the orchid population here declines a bit.

I'll note that Peter Lin grows a damn lot of Phals and very well, and he grows with moss. I've noticed, though, that he doesn't grow so much in moss, as around moss. The plants I've gotten from him mostly have their roots growing on the outside of a densely packed sphagnum mass.

And there you have it; one woman's journey from barkophobe to barkophile.

The end.

[nicola]

There are obviously a number of factors that determine the choice of the growth medium.
Environmental conditions, time available, the plant needs, market availability, among others.
Each one of us determines the order of relevance of the factors and then tries to find the appropriate medium.
My priority is to obtain the best possible growth rate and I believe that roots are the main key to it.
My ideal medium should retain a high amount of water but at the same time have a good air circulation, allowing it to dry quickly.
It should also decay slowly, and avoid compacting.
Moss definitely does not work for me, it remains wet for weeks, and it becomes too compact.
Bark here is hard to find, and if is not of good quality, it decomposes too quickly.
I am now using for almost a year coir rope cut into pieces of about half an inch in transparent pots with a layer of charcoal at the bottom.
I started using it with some Phalaenopsis and now I'm using it for Cattleya, Oncidium and Zygopetalum.
For now it is the best match to the characteristics I was looking for and I'm happy with the results.
ciao Nicola

[bil]

Originally Posted by nicola

My ideal medium should retain a high amount of water but at the same time have a good air circulation, allowing it to dry quickly.

I am now using for almost a year coir rope cut into pieces of about half an inch

two points here.

1. The important thing is WHAT WORKS FOR YOU.

2. Coir rope cut into short lengths. May I compliment you on thinking outside of the box. That's really quite devious.

---------- Post added at 06:13 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:31 AM ----------

Originally Posted by bethmarie

I deplore adding fuel to a discriminatory fire, but it would be less than truthful to not admit here that I've been moving my Phals from moss to bark over the last few weeks. I've grown in moss for years, and have happy healthy Phals, but can't help noticing that the ones I bring home from the greenhouse in bark have healthier roots by far.

Moss was a choice of overwhelm for me. I have too many plants that must be carted from the grow room to the kitchen for water, and the fewer days per week that happens, the better.

I decided to grow fewer plants and grow them as well as possible, and so must whittle down the collection over the spring. Hence, I am turning over a new leaf, the Phals are moving into bark, and I am hoping I don't kill them before the orchid population here declines a bit.

I'll note that Peter Lin grows a damn lot of Phals and very well, and he grows with moss. I've noticed, though, that he doesn't grow so much in moss, as around moss. The plants I've gotten from him mostly have their roots growing on the outside of a densely packed sphagnum mass.

And there you have it; one woman's journey from barkophobe to barkophile.

The end.

Yeah. As I think I said, the plants I have bought in moss have varied from the bad to the rootless. Like you, I have had orchids arrive attached to a compacted plug of dead roots and moss, with a live root or two on top of the moss.
I'd suggest using large bark, not the fine, I use bark that is in about 2" chunks. I also sieve mine. Least you think me OCD or deranged, I do it for this reason. Any bag will contain mostly 2", but there will be quite a bit of smaller sizes and those will block the spaces between the big bits. So I have a coarse, medium and a fine sieve. After the coarse one, I throw all the big stuff into the Phal bag, and then I re-sieve what went thru.
What goes thru the fine sieve at the end is far too fine to be of any use to orchids, but I save it as a soil additive for potted plants.

A suggestion about the watering? The problem with orchids is that they have to be watered, and watered so that water runs thru, but they mustn't sit in water.

Carrying orchids from pillar to post to water is a pain, so here's what I do. I take a saucer suitable for the pot size (I use wide, shallow pots I make myself) and put another saucer a few sizes smaller on that upside down, and sit the orchid on that.

Then when I water, I use a 5 litre spray. It takes longer, but by the time the water runs out of the bottom, the plant has had enough. The water is caught in the saucer, which holds it away from the orchid. It evaporates to give humidity, and you can remove any surplus with a large hypodermic syringe with a bit of tubing on the end instead of a needle.

[Subrosa]

Originally Posted by bil

two points here.

1. The important thing is WHAT WORKS FOR YOU.

2. Coir rope cut into short lengths. May I compliment you on thinking outside of the box. That's really quite devious.

---------- Post added at 06:13 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:31 AM ----------



Yeah. As I think I said, the plants I have bought in moss have varied from the bad to the rootless. Like you, I have had orchids arrive attached to a compacted plug of dead roots and moss, with a live root or two on top of the moss.
I'd suggest using large bark, not the fine, I use bark that is in about 2" chunks. I also sieve mine. Least you think me OCD or deranged, I do it for this reason. Any bag will contain mostly 2", but there will be quite a bit of smaller sizes and those will block the spaces between the big bits. So I have a coarse, medium and a fine sieve. After the coarse one, I throw all the big stuff into the Phal bag, and then I re-sieve what went thru.
What goes thru the fine sieve at the end is far too fine to be of any use to orchids, but I save it as a soil additive for potted plants.

A suggestion about the watering? The problem with orchids is that they have to be watered, and watered so that water runs thru, but they mustn't sit in water.

Carrying orchids from pillar to post to water is a pain, so here's what I do. I take a saucer suitable for the pot size (I use wide, shallow pots I make myself) and put another saucer a few sizes smaller on that upside down, and sit the orchid on that.

Then when I water, I use a 5 litre spray. It takes longer, but by the time the water runs out of the bottom, the plant has had enough. The water is caught in the saucer, which holds it away from the orchid. It evaporates to give humidity, and you can remove any surplus with a large hypodermic syringe with a bit of tubing on the end instead of a needle.

Good system, just one observation. If you think out and properly size the smaller pot (or whatever you use as a pedestal) you don't need to worry about removing excess water. Measure twice, manually drain never!