My Dendrobium and I hate each other

[King_of_orchid_growing:)]

I may not own a whole lot of hybrids, but I'm aware that many of the commonly available hybrids are not the dark green variety. Many of the Dendrobium hybrids that people get their hands on easily tend to fall into sections Spathulata, Phalaenanthe, and the hybrids that are in section Dendrobium that are commonly, (and often confusingly), referred to as "Dendrobium Nobile Types".

Neither one of these three hybrid groups tend to naturally have leaves that are as dark green as the plant shown in this thread.

I do not agree that it is one of those Dendrobiums that have leaves that are naturally dark green in appearance. I'm very aware of the fact that certain Dendrobiums do have naturally dark green leaves. I own a few, and I don't have any reason to believe that her plant is one of those naturally dark green leafed Dendrobiums. I think it's most likely that it's not getting enough light.

It is definitely not a "Dendrobium Nobile Type" hybrid. They have very different looking canes and are usually not quite as large.

If it is a Dendrobium that falls within section Spathulata, it has no dormancy.

If it is a Dendrobium that falls in section Phalaenanthe, they actually do have a winter dormancy, but people will differ in opinion on whether it should receive a winter break or not for this group. For me, I prefer providing a winter break.

[NYCorchidman]

I grew up with a greenhouse with dendrobium hybrids involving den phal and/or spatulata.
Vast majority has dark green leaves. Some do have very light green.

Phal type generally have distinct rest period but do not kept too cool and do not shed leaves.
Spatulata group is year round growing and flowering only if high temperature is maintained.
For most home and greenhouse growers in the area where winter is significantly cooler, they do go into "sleep" period and start growing again once spring comes.

As I explained in my earlier post, you just cannot tell whether or not certain plants are getting enough light by looking at how green the leaves are.
It's just wrong.

[court_b]

Soo I had that "gut" feeling something was wrong with those two canes. They got even more droopy this week.

Yesterday, I went orchid shopping at my favorite shop, Fantasy Orchids in Colorado. I started talking to the owner and he suggested I check the root system. Well long behold, I took the Den. out of it's pot this morning and it had significant rot!!!!!!! So, I start cutting away at all the dead root. When I picked it up, the two questionable canes fell off! All the root rot was from those canes, the other canes were still holding good roots.
Lesson learned.
I repotted the good canes/roots and separately repotted the rotted ones, which have absolutely NO roots left. We will see what happens. Also, soaked both in Physan.
I wish I would have taken a picture. The smell was new as well.
As stated already, lesson learned.
Maybe this will help other newbies...go with your gut!

[Paul]

Originally Posted by NYCorchidman

I grew up with a greenhouse with dendrobium hybrids involving den phal and/or spatulata.
Vast majority has dark green leaves. Some do have very light green.

As I explained in my earlier post, you just cannot tell whether or not certain plants are getting enough light by looking at how green the leaves are.
It's just wrong.

I do not agree with you, NY.

For many orchids, leaf color is a very good indicator of what they could use light-wise. While I agree that there are plants that are total exceptions, and that there are plants that will flower with deeper green leaves, there are many commonly grown ones will not. (I had a Cattletonia once that would bake outside all afternoon in direct full sun and the leaves never burned but rather remained dark green, so I understand what you are saying.) Furthermore, if an orchid refuses to flower, it is very often due to insufficient light. Lack of an appropriate cooling or dormancy period is the next most likely cause. The fact that the OP has been growing this at phal light levels makes light insufficiency highly likely.

CourtB, glad you found the source of the issue with those canes. Had it not been a case of the canes having rotted, I would have suspected that the leaf issue was merely a case of old leaves on their way out. Though you likely already know this, while there are exceptions your den will likely want a very coarse media.

[Jenn4a]

Originally Posted by court_b

Soo I had that "gut" feeling something was wrong with those two canes. They got even more droopy this week.

Yesterday, I went orchid shopping at my favorite shop, Fantasy Orchids in Colorado. I started talking to the owner and he suggested I check the root system. Well long behold, I took the Den. out of it's pot this morning and it had significant rot!!!!!!! So, I start cutting away at all the dead root. When I picked it up, the two questionable canes fell off! All the root rot was from those canes, the other canes were still holding good roots.
Lesson learned.
I repotted the good canes/roots and separately repotted the rotted ones, which have absolutely NO roots left. We will see what happens. Also, soaked both in Physan.
I wish I would have taken a picture. The smell was new as well.
As stated already, lesson learned.
Maybe this will help other newbies...go with your gut!

This happened to me kind of. I was really new into orchids and I got some cattleyas. 2 of them were seedlings, and their was some sort of infection... They have 6-7 pseudobulbs each, and they both split down the center. I lost almost all the roots. I almost always repot when I get a new orchid now. Even if the media is fresh, there's usually some pests inside the pot.

Physan doesn't really do much on the plant (in my experience.) I mainly use it to clean the growing area and such. If you have amazon, you can buy a systemic fungicide. Search for cleary's fungicide and the generic one will pop up. I believe that saved my cattleyas; physan, not so much. Since my sick Catts, I've purchased rooting hormone, seaweed extract, copper fungicide, and some insecticides. The rooting hormone and seaweed extract are great!

[court_b]

Originally Posted by Jenn4a

This happened to me kind of. I was really new into orchids and I got some cattleyas. 2 of them were seedlings, and their was some sort of infection... They have 6-7 pseudobulbs each, and they both split down the center. I lost almost all the roots. I almost always repot when I get a new orchid now. Even if the media is fresh, there's usually some pests inside the pot.

Physan doesn't really do much on the plant (in my experience.) I mainly use it to clean the growing area and such. If you have amazon, you can buy a systemic fungicide. Search for cleary's fungicide and the generic one will pop up. I believe that saved my cattleyas; physan, not so much. Since my sick Catts, I've purchased rooting hormone, seaweed extract, copper fungicide, and some insecticides. The rooting hormone and seaweed extract are great!

Thanks! That's great to know! The infected canes literally have no roots left, such a bummer but maybe they'll come around. That's good to know your experience with Physan and what works. I'll have to research the products you suggested. I have heard several people talk about rooting hormone and seaweed. I just bought a mini Catt this weekend, maybe I'll check out it's roots a little closer.
Thanks for the info!

[bil]

Wellll... I have had such bad experiences with roots that I automatically repot everything, even if it's in flower.

Better to loose flowers than a whole plant.

[court_b]

I honestly have never thought of that. I guess I have trusted the people that I get my orchids from but I think from now on that's what I'll do. I had not thought about pests in the media either. I guess it's a learning experience through trial, error and experiences!!

Originally Posted by bil

Wellll... I have had such bad experiences with roots that I automatically repot everything, even if it's in flower.

Better to loose flowers than a whole plant.

[Jenn4a]

You're welcome btw, you probably shouldn't use anything copper on dendrobiums; I've read that, but I don't have any experience with dens.

In a pinch, using hydrogen peroxide 3% is helpful. I've used it on several orchid's roots and nothing bad has happened. I wouldn't leave it between leaves, or in crowns though. I don't know the specifics but the peroxide "turns" into water and oxygen after awhile. I occasionally use isopropyl alcohol when I see suspicious areas, but I learned my lesson. Don't over do it, or you can do further damage.

[court_b]

Interesting regarding the dens and copper. I'll really have to make sure to do my research on that. I'm generally pretty good at making sure my plants get really great care, I want the best for them and for them to thrive! 😃 They are my kids. I haven't read too much about hydrogen peroxide either, I'll add that on to my list on items to research! Thanks Jenn4a!!!

Originally Posted by Jenn4a

You're welcome btw, you probably shouldn't use anything copper on dendrobiums; I've read that, but I don't have any experience with dens.

In a pinch, using hydrogen peroxide 3% is helpful. I've used it on several orchid's roots and nothing bad has happened. I wouldn't leave it between leaves, or in crowns though. I don't know the specifics but the peroxide "turns" into water and oxygen after awhile. I occasionally use isopropyl alcohol when I see suspicious areas, but I learned my lesson. Don't over do it, or you can do further damage.