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Register Brown and clear spots or blisters on Phal leaves?! Members Brown and clear spots or blisters on Phal leaves?! Brown and clear spots or blisters on Phal leaves?! Today's PostsBrown and clear spots or blisters on Phal leaves?! Brown and clear spots or blisters on Phal leaves?! Brown and clear spots or blisters on Phal leaves?!
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  #1  
Old 01-04-2015, 10:57 PM
TheEarnestOrchid TheEarnestOrchid is offline
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Brown and clear spots or blisters on Phal leaves?! Female
Default Brown and clear spots or blisters on Phal leaves?!

Hello everyone, I seem to be having a sudden problem with the leaves of one of my phals...

To give a brief overview of it's history: I was given this phal as a present about two months ago (purchased from a grocery-store), and other than the roots (starting to rot in old sphagnum) it looked extremely healthy. It was in bloom, then due to an accident the spikes were broken, I put cinnamon on the cuts, one of the spikes started to regrow and now has several buds and everything seemed fine.

However = two days ago, what looked like a clear halo appeared on one of the leaves. By the next day, this had developed into a raised brown blister - raised on both sides of the leaf - surrounded by an indented circle...

Then today (3rd day), when I looked at it again, I now noticed a second larger watery circle (with a small brown dot in the centre??) higher up on the same leaf...When I looked more closely, I also noticed a similar patch on the top of a second leaf further down.......

I will try to attach photos - please bear with me!

I think this is some sort of infection, given how suddenly it has occurred/quickly it is progressing, and plan to amputate the leaf/sections :S

All help is greatly appreciated! I hope it's not too late to save this phal...
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  #2  
Old 01-04-2015, 11:12 PM
TheEarnestOrchid TheEarnestOrchid is offline
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Brown and clear spots or blisters on Phal leaves?! Female
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Here are some photos (hopefully!)...
Attached Thumbnails
Brown and clear spots or blisters on Phal leaves?!-dscn2860-jpg   Brown and clear spots or blisters on Phal leaves?!-dscn2817-jpg  
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  #3  
Old 01-04-2015, 11:18 PM
TheEarnestOrchid TheEarnestOrchid is offline
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Brown and clear spots or blisters on Phal leaves?! Female
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Yes! It worked

So the right photo above is how the brown spot started (1st day) and the other photo shows how it has developed

From other angles:
Front of leaf = Brown and clear spots or blisters on Phal leaves?!-dscn2839-jpg

Back of leaf = Brown and clear spots or blisters on Phal leaves?!-dscn2841-jpg
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  #4  
Old 01-05-2015, 08:33 PM
WhiteRabbit WhiteRabbit is offline
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Could there have been water on the leaves during cooler temps?
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  #5  
Old 01-06-2015, 07:54 AM
The Mutant The Mutant is offline
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Could it be Edema? Here is a link describing it shortly: Environmental damage (it's the first subject on the page). Here are some more pictures of Edema: Images of Edema on orchids.
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  #6  
Old 01-07-2015, 07:53 AM
TheEarnestOrchid TheEarnestOrchid is offline
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Brown and clear spots or blisters on Phal leaves?! Female
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Thank you very much to WhiteRabbit and The Mutant for your replies!

This is probably going to be a very drawn out answer, so I apologise in advance to anyone who dares read it, but I think it's worth mentioning (maybe):

Both Edema and e.g. fungal infections from water on the leaves require water to be present, yep? In the case of this orchid, I had not watered it in 6-7 days or misted the leaves. The only water that could have been present would have been from misting other indoor plants. In the two days before the problem “began” the weather had been really hot and dry - so even if a few droplets of water had made their way to the phal, surely they would have evaporated quickly (or even run off from the near-vertical leaf)? Adding further to the confusion/mystery/horror, whilst watering my two other phals during this time period I ran water all over their leaves to refresh them, placed them on the same table and these were absolutely fine…

However, I think what actually caused this is a deeper underlying problem with this plant (hopefully not caused by me – I mean, you’d think if I didn’t kill my other two phals in 1yr+ , this one would survive 2months in my “care” ahaha…)

To re-cap, originally, it had two flower spikes. Shortly after its unfortunate arrival, it went flying from a bad case of open-window-curtain and the spikes snapped. I cut them off cleanly and applied cinnamon. One of the spikes began to grow again and seemed happy, the second spike looked unchanged i.e. deep green, healthy etc…

HOWEVER (*cue foreboding music*) when I went to amputate the sick leaf sections yesterday, I accidentally brushed against the second spike, and to my absolute horror, the outer layer of its “skin” came away, revealing green, watery mushiness…The spike had been rotting (??) all the way to its base this whole time!! I think it’s understandable that I now feel paranoid about every other flower spike I’ve removed recently and whether I applied enough cinnamon.

Furthermore, whilst staring at the sick phal in a near panicked state (hahah) I noticed the following odd black hole…almost as if a leaf has been pulled out? (On the same side/directly above the rotten spike)

Brown and clear spots or blisters on Phal leaves?!-dscn3083-jpg

Do you think it’s possible this phal has previously suffered some sort of rot (which has returned?) Or that one spike became infected, because I didn’t apply enough cinnamon to the wound??!

At the end of the day, I am just curious what could have happened. I have removed all of the sick tissue that I could find, being short of fungicide (and with no physan20 in AUS) I have covered the entire phal in cinnamon (apart from the roots, which can = desiccation) and given it 24hrs to rest…It seems alright for now and there is probably nothing else I can do for it. If anyone has any ideas, I’d love to hear them. Otherwise, let’s just wait and see and I’ll post on here whether it survives or not (for the future reference of anyone who Googles, “cover entire orchid in cinnamon” )

Here’s hoping.
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  #7  
Old 01-08-2015, 08:04 AM
The Mutant The Mutant is offline
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As far as I understand from edema it's not cause by water getting on the leaf, but by the roots absorbing the water faster than it can evaporate from the leaves. It doesn't really seem likely though, considered the temps you've had and how long ago you watered it...

That hole looks nasty. How does the stem feel when you squeeze it? Mushy or firm? It looks like it could've had some sort of rot going on, so keep a close eye on it. I hope the cinnamon will be enough and that it makes it!
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  #8  
Old 01-08-2015, 08:35 AM
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Brown and clear spots or blisters on Phal leaves?! Male
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That is a fungal infection. Water certainly exacerbates fungal infections, and is most certainly a vector for spreading them, but need not be present for them to grow.


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  #9  
Old 01-08-2015, 10:03 PM
orchidlover1554 orchidlover1554 is offline
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Brown and clear spots or blisters on Phal leaves?!
Default Blistered Phal Baby

Hi I am sorry to hear about your phal. I have one as well what ever it is it spreads fast. Upon first notice it was just a little colored like pimple as it grew it changed color to a darker brown with a glow surrounding the entire little circle. by day 3 the circle had turned to mush. I also thought it was from a drop of water when I mist I'm not sure. This is my water culture orchid it is about I year old now it is doing great new leaves and surprising enough she has produced two baby Keikis on both sides or her base. I don't want to loose her after all she has been through poor girl HEHE Any more or other advice or info would be wonderful.
Thank you
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Brown and clear spots or blisters on Phal leaves?!-img_20150107_194111630-jpg  
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  #10  
Old 11-14-2015, 07:13 AM
TheEarnestOrchid TheEarnestOrchid is offline
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Brown and clear spots or blisters on Phal leaves?! Female
Default Update

Well I promised I'd give an update, so after an eon I'm back to do just that...

Long story short, 3 days after my last post the entire plant (no exaggeration) turned completely brown and mushy and I sadly disposed of it. Over the neighbour's fence. OK not quite!! Just trying to keep an otherwise sad topic erm amusing...(either that or deeply inappropriate?! ) (we have very kind neighbours)

Thank you again to everyone who gave advice, it was greatly appreciated

Ultimately I think, as indicated by the black gaping void (reminiscent of a swirling vortex sucking in the souls of any unfortunate onlookers...) in the stem, it was a diseased plant and I'm just glad I kept it separated from my other phals.

On the topic of whom, I feel like launching into a dramatic rant about going on a three month trip and leaving my orchids in the care of a family friend (with written instructions) and returning to a complete phal-massacre (sitting semi-submerged in water of all things)...but far sadder things are happening in this world, so...

Luckily all of the others survived, a bit worse for the wear (imagine not being watered for three months in a pure bark mix - good thing it was winter!) but they'll pull through...The Bletilla striata is even flowering - in the ground outside of all things! (Only significant because we're talking about Tasmania, though admittedly it's not as stereotypically cold here as most Tasmanians will have you believe, we just like to scare away all the tourists! Jk jk, if you're considering visiting, please do! You won't regret it!! The scenery is on par with New Zealand (identical?) and our natives orchids are stunning (by which I mean elusive) but nevertheless... (There, I've done my bit for the State now to go back to being an irresponsible uni student ))

orchidlover1554 - Thank you for your kind words! I hope your phal survived, it sounded like it was really trying

...might add some photos when I get the chance...
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