How many did you kill? - Sad but make us feel better thread!

[TOMMYMIAMI]

Ok, I am pretty sure we all did it. My friends did it, my orchid sellers did it, gardener that takes care of some houses with hundreds of orchids told me he did it. BUT, it is always sad, and in some way upsetting for all of us to LOOSE one of our orchid babies, especially if it is due to our mistakes! I DID KILL 2 THIS YEAR, and one is handing by a thread right now. Oncidium that was going down for quite some time just gave up in March, and my newly purchased gorgeous big Cattleya did not stand our Florida 3 week rain stream as well:-((( Both of these were MY FAULT, did not catch over watering on time I have unfortunately another baby pretty bad sick now, my Dendrobium Heterocarpum, also purchased not even a month ago, and yet over watered again! This one is still fighting though, so I am hopeful and thinking positive thoughts! OK, TO MAKE ME FEEL BETTER, I know there are members here with a few orchids, as well as members with a few hundreds (or maybe even thousands???) - Please, can you share, on average, HOW MANY ORCHIDS did you kill, in your lifetime, in a year, or recently? Just though this will make US, still beginners in the process of learning, feel just a little bit better, to know that IT HAPPENS TO EVERYONE! Thanks for sharing.

[bellini girl]

Killed a few in the early days. Less now, ever since I hooked up with OB. Lots of great advice here stopped the downward spiral. I once met a big time grower who told me he had " a book of the dead". go figure. You're not alone ...for sure

[DweamGoiL]

OK, I'll bite. I killed 1 in the early 90's and decided against ever even looking at an orchid again. And then recently, I killed a beautiful Phal. I am an overwaterer and I fight that impulse with every ounce of my being every single day so I won't kill any more.

[King_of_orchid_growing:)]

Originally Posted by DweamGoiL

OK, I'll bite. I killed 1 in the early 90's and decided against ever even looking at an orchid again. And then recently, I killed a beautiful Phal. I am an overwaterer and I fight that impulse with every ounce of my being every single day so I won't kill any more.

Then you need an orchid that can withstand that kind of watering regimen!

Have you ever considered orchids that are in the super-genus Pleurothallis?

They love water.

---------- Post added at 06:59 AM ---------- Previous post was at 06:52 AM ----------

Originally Posted by CambriaWhat

"Orchids are not difficult to grow" is the phrase that really grinds my gears. It is a bold-faced lie!

Not all orchids are easy to grow. If a beginner said, "I want to grow a Dendrophylax lindenii (aka Ghost Orchid)." I'd tell them to start with a different orchid species.

You most likely started growing Phals just like the huge majority of us - yes, that includes me. And like I've said many times before, Phals, in my opinion do not make great introductions to people beginning in the hobby.

If you really want a better suggestion of better beginner's orchids, you can let me know what kind of growing area you plan to grow in and what the conditions of that intended growing area is, and we'll see if there's an orchid that fits that perfectly. When you get one, you might change your mind about orchids.

The problem with orchids is that they span the entire world, except Antarctica, (there are no orchids in Antarctica). You gotta know what you're getting yourself into when you get one.

Originally Posted by CambriaWhat

Orchids are in fact difficult to grow! They require a very strange mix of attention and neglect and they really hold a grudge when you piss them off!

A relationship with an orchid is a real emotional investment and I get so attached to my plants, if they're not doing well it's absolutely maddening!

Not when you start off with the right orchid!

There are quite a few orchids that are very easy to grow. It was just that you weren't told which ones they were when you first started out.

A lot of people assume that Phals are the beginner's choice because they are so readily available.

As an experienced home grower and a person who was trained in nursery growing for the crop plant Phalaenopsis, I can tell you right now, in my honest opinion, Phalaenopsis are perhaps one of the worst orchids for a beginner to start with.

---------- Post added at 07:03 AM ---------- Previous post was at 06:59 AM ----------

Originally Posted by The Orchid Boy

I've been growing orchids for 3 years now and have killed 2 noid cattleyas and 1 teeny, tiny runt Paph. liemianum Flasklings died, it was the size of my pinky nail. My first orchid, a noid phal is just recovering from my mistakes. After my 4th orchid (Paph. delenatii) I found Orchid Board and SlipperTalk. My orchids did better and I discovered rarer orchids. I deflasked for the first time this winter and got 40 plants from the flask, 39 still alive. Now I'm addicted to flasks, I want more! But I have to remember that just like puppies, flasklings don't stay small forever.

Nice.

Originally Posted by The Orchid Boy

Sometimes orchids die at the hands of professional growers because they have so many and can't perfect conditions for them all or forget about that one way back there on the bench.

How true you are! That's exactly what I observed.

---------- Post added at 07:06 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:03 AM ----------

Originally Posted by mattryan

I can tell you one thing I've only been growing orchids for 3-4 yrs now. But I really try not to dwell on the losses, but the knowledge that I have now from that loss. What worked, what didn't.Sometimes an orchid no matter what you do or try does not succeed. We've all had those losses and they really stink esp if it is a favorite. I've lost maybe 10 phals (noids thank heavens) 1 noid onc. Now I do have a Bllr. Peggy Ruth Carpenter that is NOT doing well (any help apprieciated) and a Degamora Jay Yamada in the same sad shape help also needed. I am trying my hand at paphs a Sedenii and randy McDonald so I might be crying in my glass of vino right along with TOMMYMIAMI, but I am praying I won't be!

Cheers Tommy buy another orchid I say!!

Cheryl

I was going to say a very similar thing, actually.

I have lost lots of far rarer orchids. I can't beat myself up forever!

I must learn from those mistakes and move on.

I'm also very certain that there will be other individuals of those same species floating around somewhere to be available for purchase some time down the line.

When I make a list of orchids I have, I separate out the dead ones from the living ones, and I'll ultimately see, that in the end, I grow far more beautiful orchids than I have had perish.

---------- Post added at 07:17 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:06 AM ----------

Originally Posted by jesscorine

I finally gave up on a rescue phal...I just cracked the bloom spike and tossed it in the trash. The roots were black, leaves were wrinkly, and I had enough others that were doing better. Now I'm watching my Den Spectabile...I have no clue what's going on. It's shriveled and yellowing in spots but the leaves are still smooth. I have a feeling it might kick the bucket, but I'm not ready to toss it yet. I've actually unintentionally nursed two phals back to life that I had given up on. They both have new leaves and roots so I'm just watching them. The last in question is a phal with great thick, green roots but persistent black rot on the leaves/base. It's so hard to give up on anything!

You ever check the roots?

What seems like "unexplainable ill health" is usually not "unexplainable". If you can't see what's going on with the stems and the leaves, then there's the roots.

Dendrobium spectabile is an intermediate to warm grower (55 F - 95 F).

It grows in moderately bright to bright indirect light, about the same as you would give a Cattleya.

Be careful not to over pot.

They are not too fond of root damage and root disturbance. In general, I've found many Section Latouria Dendrobiums to not like root disturbance.

Section Latouria Dens, also like humidity. About 70% - 80% humidity is what they like.

Moderate air flow is preferred.

[Paul]

Originally Posted by RJSquirrel

I dont really kill orchids. I get rid of them when they get so ugly I cant stand em anymore.

It generally takes a while before reaching that point. Particularly when new to the hobby, it's quite common for folks to want to "save" every plant. As years go by, I think one tends to get a bit more ... hard-hearted.

That said, I still after about 20yrs of plant obsession tend to try to nurse any of my plants that fall sickly back to health probably long after many would throw in the towel. And there are times that throwing away healthy plant material still "kills" me. But I have gotten better about it. Had a Sharry Baby several winters ago that wasn't doing all that great for me and then it came down with a major mealie infestation. Tossed it outside as a "gift" to Old Man Winter and let him do the honors. In one of my terrs, I leveled/chopped down a African violet that had gotten too big for its britches (it was trying to attain "shrub" status, I think). Found takers for the multitude of cuttings which otherwise I would have just tossed.

Originally Posted by CambriaWhat

"Orchids are not difficult to grow" is the phrase that really grinds my gears. It is a bold-faced lie!

Philodendrons are not difficult. Chinese evergreens are not difficult. Peace lilies are not difficult. Dracaenas and Zamioculcas are near impossible to kill.

Orchids are in fact difficult to grow! They require a very strange mix of attention and neglect and they really hold a grudge when you piss them off!

Personally, I find orchids much easier and far more forgiving than a lot of plants. And while peace lilies may be easy, I find them to be BORING BORING BORING! (I think I would be hard-pressed to think of a more boring common plant off the top of my head.) The vast majority of Dracaena do nothing for me either nor many of the Aglaonema. Additionally, many of the thin leaved plants like Aglaonema do NOT do well in my conditions. The dry winter air plays hell with such leaves and such plants are typically spidermite magnets for me. Some Philodendrons can be prissy and many require a huge amount of space. Now if instead you are referring to Pothos (which is not a Philodendron, btw), yes they are easy for MOST people -- however, I know folks (including my sis) who have managed to kill them. Then there are those I have known who have killed of ZZ plants in record time. So the long and short is that "easy" is a very relative term.

Originally Posted by King_of_orchid_growing:)

Not when you start off with the right orchid!

There are quite a few orchids that are very easy to grow. It was just that you weren't told which ones they were when you first started out.

As an experienced home grower and a person who was trained in nursery growing for the crop plant Phalaenopsis, I can tell you right now, in my honest opinion, Phalaenopsis are perhaps one of the worst orchids for a beginner to start with.

I don't agree about Phals being among the worst ones for a newbie to start out with -- there are soooo many that could be far worse. (Though many of those are not so easily available.) Again it depends upon the conditions one can and will provide. The easy availability and low cost of the mass produced phals is benefical to the beginner. They can feel free to "give it a go" without a large outlay of cash. Replacement likewise is easy. However, the media such phals are typically found in at the BBSs and the care directions provided are such that the plant's continued existence is questionable at best -- especially in the hands of a newbie.

I completely agree with KoOG about choosing the right orchid for your conditions and knowledge as to what method of husbandry is best in your conditions. It can make all the difference in the world. Once you determine what conditions you can provide, THEN you can make an informed choice of an orchid suitable for you.

The "difficult" part with orchids, in general, is many folks want an exact "recipe" for their care (give X amount of water every X many days ....). Such a desire, while understandable, is completely unrealistic. What works for me in my home is hardly likely to work well for someone growing in humid Louisiana or Florida.

Originally Posted by King_of_orchid_growing:)

Neostylis is temperature tolerant and can handle temperatures down to 36 F and up to 110 F, with no problems. Make sure that if the temperatures do get above 100 F, that they receive good air flow.

I've killed several of those over the years too.

Originally Posted by Joseia

There is one less Paph in the world because of me. I can't even look at a Paph when I go to my local grower without the poor things trying to grow legs and run away.

I hear you there! I'm a licensed paph/phrag serial killer. And to those who would otherwise like to wax poetically as to how easy paphs and phrags are to grow, I have only one thing to say to you --

"Don't make me hurt you."

Fortunately there are not that many paphs or phrags I like enough to want to own.

Originally Posted by Joseia

A Neo Stylis Lou Sneary Bluebird got close enough to death to see the Pearly Gates and hear the choir singing. Neostylis - easy plant, they said; forgiving plant for beginners, they said; so easy you can just stick it on a windowsill, they said. Yeah, right! Almost killed that one three times. It's finally doing well.

Well congrats on that. Mine never did recover from its death spiral. Like you, this one was anything but easy for me in my conditions.

Originally Posted by DweamGoiL

I am an overwaterer and I fight that impulse with every ounce of my being every single day so I won't kill any more.

Then, in addition to KoOG's Pleurothallid suggestion, you might consider trying (if you haven't done so already) alternative culture. For example, plants in baskets and mounts are difficult for many of us who grow indoors in the winter lands -- our dry indoor winter air can be brutal. Such plants require much more frequent watering than potted plants. For potted plants, you could try a completely inert media like Hydroton/Prime Agra/Aliflor, Epiweb chunks, or the puffed recycled glass "rocks" used as a Diatomite substitute. Such materials do not hold a great deal of water which, again, would therefore require frequent watering. And then you might consider trying SH (Semi-Hydro) cultivation. Personally, I found it to be an abysmal failure with the plants I tried, HOWEVER I know a number of folks (including Ray from First Rays orchids) for whom this has proven to be a highly successful strategy.

[TOMMYMIAMI]

Thanks Paul, Hilarious comments, made me laugh:-)

---------- Post added at 07:50 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:38 PM ----------

Thanks King. You know, there is hundreds of pages, hundreds of chats, and hundreds of opinions about each orchid. The more you read, the more confused you get. Different people suggest totally different methods for the same orchid - that being said, we already learned what what works for one does not work for others, what works for my Miami climate does not work for others in new york or Boston. Also, i found each orchid, even when the same species, kinda INDIVIDUAL, like people are. My friend in Key West grows everything outside, at her garden, having the same dendros I have on the FULL DAY direct sun, they are doing magic things, blooming like crazy nuts, she has her cattleya in the deep shade mounted on the palm tree, does not get any sun at all, even filtered no, and again, blooming nuts, however the same dendros i got in key west and put on direct sun at my balcony got total burned, and my cattleyas did not ever bloom because I had them in shade, GO FIGURE. You are absolutely right about dendrobiums, I got into them this year, and i found out, that they are so wide range, from cold growing to hot growing, the ones needing only full shade to ones needing nearly full sun. I am glad for this forum, and for the knowledge I got by reading books and articles, I learned many lessons and since July I do order only orchids that can actually make it here in Miami, so that is great progress for me:-) My issue with cattleyas - over water, till this summer, when I switched some to hydroton marbles, and got some mounted, and they are doing JUST FINE! my Schomburgkias is on full afternoon sun, mounted, the same conditions that seller had, and it is loving it! Even my Brassavola, that again we read somewhere should NOT BE on direct sun, is getting full speed late afternoon sun from 5pm till sunset, and is growing like magic! My friend in Key West put the same plant on direct evening sun, and got toasted. Maybe Key West is again different than Miami, but i do not follow everything I read anymore, I am more TRY AND LEARN kind of guy these days, watching the new spot and how they are doing at that spot, and if I see it is not working for them, I do switch:-)

[nenella]

Well, I moved 400kms further South than where I had been living for the last 6 yrs... and I'm at -5 orchids. Seem to have all "stabilised" for now.
I had an Onc Spacellatum flower for the first time as well as my Miltonia spectabilis (project plant) flower for the first time.... So just shows how conditions can change.. also I admit I didn't /haven't been looking after my 'chids like I used to... My Neo falcata is flowering now with 3 spikes; last year flowered a lot earlier in the year and had 7 spikes.... just to give a few examples...

[catherinecarney]

I was at a show once and I mentioned to a breeder that I had killed a lot of orchids. He said "You're not an orchid nut until you kill 10 in a year." My thought was "Well, this is going to be one EXPENSIVE hobby."

I will say I'm doing better--I'm down to about three fatalities this year (Enc. polybulbon, Tolumnia velutina, and a no-ID multifloral phal). All three were doing well until we had a power outage (THREE DAYS due to the incompetence of our power company) after a thunderstorm that knocked out the lights and fan in their terrarium in 90+ degree heat (can we say fungal rot boys and girls?). I was NOT happy....

Over the years (until I discovered OB) I killed a lot more. And, knowing me, I will probably still have losses when I try new plants. I just branched out into begonias (cane/angelwing types and species) and sinningia and have experienced a similar mortality rate. Sigh.

Catherine

[jesscorine]

I finally gave up on a rescue phal...I just cracked the bloom spike and tossed it in the trash. The roots were black, leaves were wrinkly, and I had enough others that were doing better. Now I'm watching my Den Spectabile...I have no clue what's going on. It's shriveled and yellowing in spots but the leaves are still smooth. I have a feeling it might kick the bucket, but I'm not ready to toss it yet. I've actually unintentionally nursed two phals back to life that I had given up on. They both have new leaves and roots so I'm just watching them. The last in question is a phal with great thick, green roots but persistent black rot on the leaves/base. It's so hard to give up on anything!

[TOMMYMIAMI]

Originally Posted by catherinecarney

I was at a show once and I mentioned to a breeder that I had killed a lot of orchids. He said "You're not an orchid nut until you kill 10 in a year." My thought was "Well, this is going to be one EXPENSIVE hobby."

I will say I'm doing better--I'm down to about three fatalities this year (Enc. polybulbon, Tolumnia velutina, and a no-ID multifloral phal). All three were doing well until we had a power outage (THREE DAYS due to the incompetence of our power company) after a thunderstorm that knocked out the lights and fan in their terrarium in 90+ degree heat (can we say fungal rot boys and girls?). I was NOT happy....

Over the years (until I discovered OB) I killed a lot more. And, knowing me, I will probably still have losses when I try new plants. I just branched out into begonias (cane/angelwing types and species) and sinningia and have experienced a similar mortality rate. Sigh.

Catherine

Hi
and thanks for sharing. Wow, can't imagine to kill 10 a year, that would be really expensive, and also very painful. I think I did kill maybe around 10-max 15 in the lifetime, which means for me probably last 5 years growing orchids. You are so true, this OB helps us all, and in a month plus few days I am a member,, I did learn so so much, so THANK YOU ALL THE GOOD PEOPLE who shared your opinions and advises with me and us all. I am doing definitely much better in last few years, however every year few goes, and as I said, with me it is mostly always over water. Your power outage truly sucks, but I would not consider that your fault at all, there are some things we can not control, unfortunately! Lets hope for all of us, we will get only better and the numbers will go only down from now on!

---------- Post added at 06:25 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:16 PM ----------

Originally Posted by jesscorine

I finally gave up on a rescue phal...I just cracked the bloom spike and tossed it in the trash. The roots were black, leaves were wrinkly, and I had enough others that were doing better. Now I'm watching my Den Spectabile...I have no clue what's going on. It's shriveled and yellowing in spots but the leaves are still smooth. I have a feeling it might kick the bucket, but I'm not ready to toss it yet. I've actually unintentionally nursed two phals back to life that I had given up on. They both have new leaves and roots so I'm just watching them. The last in question is a phal with great thick, green roots but persistent black rot on the leaves/base. It's so hard to give up on anything!

hi Jesscorine
and thanks for sharing. I am definitely at no position to give any advise, still learning myself every single day how to correctly care for my 70+ babies, however I have maybe similar experience so I may chip in little. First, regarding your Phals, since these were of course my first ever orchids, the "black rot" at the leave base, I did have one with the same issue, and after some research I did learn that Phals actually HATE to be misted, especially if they are growing the regular vertical way. In nature, mostly they are growing in angle, which means, that when they do get rain (or MIST in the house), the water does not store at this base we are talking about! This is what is most probably causing your problem. If it has healthy roots, I would very strongly suggest to hang it or position it in the3 way the water will be not stored at the leave base! and no misting or spraying. Regarding your Dendro, it sounds like the issue I have right now with my Dendro Heterocarpum, if you are talking about yellowing of the canes? Mine started shriveled and yellowing of the bases of the canes, plus yellowing of the leaves. It was of course the sign of over water! I did take it out of the pot and mounted it for now on the tree fern only, trying to see if I can save it. Hope this little help.

---------- Post added at 06:29 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:25 PM ----------

Originally Posted by Joseia

There is one less Paph in the world because of me. I can't even look at a Paph when I go to my local grower without the poor things trying to grow legs and run away. Almost killed the first two phals I owned, but they finally pulled through - in fact, one has a 12" flower spike growing.

A Neo Stylis Lou Sneary Bluebird got close enough to death to see the Pearly Gates and hear the choir singing. Neostylis - easy plant, they said; forgiving plant for beginners, they said; so easy you can just stick it on a windowsill, they said. Yeah, right! Almost killed that one three times. It's finally doing well in an aquarium under the MH light and I think it has a new baby fan starting. But who knows, Ole Bluebird could still end up being Deader Number Two and start pining for the fjords any day now.

Thanks Joseia, I love these they say SO EASY TO GROW, they say cattleyas are so EASY TO GROW in Florida, hahaha, and I truly killed every single one I had in last 5 years, except the ones I got this year and I finally learned how to better care for them - again, over water kill, and they are REAL EASY to over water! So I do not go by that easy to grow, or great for the beginners, cause it does not work for me at all. I have orchids that they say are hard to get to bloom, and hard to grow, and they are thriving and doing awesome things at my balcony, and than I have these BASIC ones, like cattleyas, vandas, and no matter what I do I can not make vandas bloom, and I can not keep cattleyas alive:-=))))

---------- Post added at 06:32 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:29 PM ----------

Originally Posted by catherinecarney

Gotta love the "easy for beginners" trap--yes, there are lots of tolerant plants out there, but IME they are not easy for me! Ditto for aquarium fish (especially killifish and goodeids)--I kill the "easy" ones, but the supposedly "hard" ones thrive. Go figure.

Bottom line is to figure out what you like and what works for you and your plants/animals/whatever and go with it.

Catherine

So true Catherine!

	Mistking Looking for a misting system? Look no further. Automated misting systems from MistKing are used by multitude of plant enthusiasts and are perfect for Orchids. Systems feature run dry pumps, ZipDrip valve, adjustable black nozzles, per second control! Automatically mist one growing shelf or a greenhouse full of Orchids. See MistKing testimonials