Orchids and vacation

[butterfly_muse]

Originally Posted by Discus

Although some orchids aren't supposed to like temperatures below about 15ºC (~60ºF), mine all happily overwinter at a minimum of 10ºC (~50ºF), including various phals and other vandaceous things that are supposed to sulk when cold; that said, the sun generally then raises the temperature by some 5 or so degrees C or more during the day. One thing you may find is that cold spell prompts them all to spike a few weeks after you get back - a late wedding present.

Houses in South Africa are generally not centrally heated (nor insulated), so it's pretty common for them to sit at 50-60ºF in winter {or less!}; plenty of my LOS people keep all their plants outdoors (mostly in shadehouses rather than greenhouses/tunnels) and it regularly gets to 10ºC (or lower) at night - although they all sit on the coast and are more buffered from extremes than we are ~60km inland and a few hundred meters higher up.

Point-heating (i.e. seedling mats) is often more energy efficient than space heating [you can work this out by comparing wattages] - akin to that campfire tale of native americans making a small fire and getting close to it, while paleface make big fire to warm whole world!

Given that's only about a week, most phals will be happy with a good watering before you leave - but if you have mounts, you may need someone to give them the odd sprinkling (this makes our collection need a caretaker when we go away).

---------- Post added at 11:57 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:55 AM ----------

Oh, one thing I meant to say but forgot - what orchids *won't* like is a sudden change from a house kept at 80 or whatever and then suddenly dropped to 50 overnight. If you can bear it, try dropping the thermostat by about 5 degrees a week until you get to whatever you're planning to set it to while you're away.
Keep your fans on to stop cold spots by the windows where plants generally sit. My wife thinks it's madness to have fans on in the winter, but she forgets she's warm blooded (despite her reptilian tendencies to bask near sources of heat), and that reducing the boundary layer when you're already at the ambient temperature won't make you "colder" (unless of course you're wet, in which case, watch out for evaporative chilling, which *can* be a problem in winter).

I was figuring they'd be okay if I watered them before we left. They seem to take neglect pretty well. Also the more I thought about it, the more I decided I don't trust anyone but myself to water them.

It's starting to (finally, I think...though it may not stay this way for long) get to that point where it's 85-90F during the day, and 70-ish at night. When I walked out to my car to go to work this morning, it was 69, which was AWESOME! If I gradually open the windows while it's getting cooler at night, and it drops from 85 to 65, and then 70 to 60, etc., etc., will that acclimate them pretty well?

I might look into the seedling mats to go with the lights for the winter. We have a ceiling fan that will be on most of the time, if they are going to be living where the ceiling fan is. If not, I've got a small desk fan.

[Discus]

Yes, that should acclimate them with time.

I'm not perhaps as familiar with plant physiology as I am with animal (a product of doing zoology rather than botany) but in general, things that don't regulate their internal temperature tend to have different groups/versions of enzymes that work better at different temperatures - they can change them with the seasons, but this takes time. I'm guessing plants can do this too - many ectothermic animals certainly do, and I find it unlikely that things that live at the mercy of the seasons outdoors don't have at least some faculty to do it - that said, *very* tropical plants possibly don't but should be able to tolerate it for a while (you can get quite cold in the tropics sometimes). As long as it doesn't go below 10ºC/50ºF you should be OK I think.

This rather reminds me of the practical in high school where we were trying to determine the overall Q10 of Daphnia with microscopes, warm water baths, well slides, and trying to count hundreds of bpm, and the way that their hearts eventually exploded. :/

[Lorraine]

Just my 2 cents worth. I live in South Florida and all my chids are outside. I have catts, phals and several other genera. They do very well for me over winter when our temps even get to the 40's (they don't like wind on them). Phals for one need the lower temp to send me spikes. I would water them as needed and have a great trip With cooler temps they do not seem to dry out as quickly.

[Discus]

Lorraine - good point, but even outdoors, it seldom goes from 80/90F to 40F overnight (i.e. it doesn't shift from "summer" straight into "winter") - there's a gradual seasonal increase and decrease (although of course it's day-by-day a little jagged [thanks, weather], the trend is fairly gradual).

Having a centrally heated house and then going away for a while switching the boiler off/very low is a bit like a sudden shift from summer into winter.

[butterfly_muse]

Originally Posted by Discus

Yes, that should acclimate them with time.

I'm not perhaps as familiar with plant physiology as I am with animal (a product of doing zoology rather than botany) but in general, things that don't regulate their internal temperature tend to have different groups/versions of enzymes that work better at different temperatures - they can change them with the seasons, but this takes time. I'm guessing plants can do this too - many ectothermic animals certainly do, and I find it unlikely that things that live at the mercy of the seasons outdoors don't have at least some faculty to do it - that said, *very* tropical plants possibly don't but should be able to tolerate it for a while (you can get quite cold in the tropics sometimes). As long as it doesn't go below 10ºC/50ºF you should be OK I think.

This rather reminds me of the practical in high school where we were trying to determine the overall Q10 of Daphnia with microscopes, warm water baths, well slides, and trying to count hundreds of bpm, and the way that their hearts eventually exploded. :/

That sounds........exciting? <_< I'm a mere mortal archaeologist, I don't do science that well. Except geography....and only then because it's my minor.

---------- Post added at 08:18 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:12 AM ----------

Originally Posted by Discus

Lorraine - good point, but even outdoors, it seldom goes from 80/90F to 40F overnight (i.e. it doesn't shift from "summer" straight into "winter") - there's a gradual seasonal increase and decrease (although of course it's day-by-day a little jagged [thanks, weather], the trend is fairly gradual).

Having a centrally heated house and then going away for a while switching the boiler off/very low is a bit like a sudden shift from summer into winter.

Luckily we have a smart thermostat, so we have access to our apartment's temperature all the time and we can program it as needed even if we're not there. And they're getting up to about 85 during the day, the a/c kicks on when I leave work and is around 78 when I get home at 4:30, and then is ~77-80 overnight, rinse, repeat. Except when we open the windows, but it has been so hot and muggy lately we can't.

I imagine over the winter it will be a lot like that, getting cooler during the day, warm up in the afternoon/evening, and more cool overnight but not as cold as if we weren't there. It's our first winter with the new thermostat, so I'm not sure what the plan is gonna be juuust yet. Also our weather is so damn variable, it can be 70 for a week and then suddenly drop to 30 degrees overnight and kill everything. Everyone is asking me what the weather will be like at our November wedding and all I can say is "70 or 40, raining or not, I have no idea." Lol!

[Discus]

It's sort of exciting as a teenage boy, and then later, you grow up a bit and think "Wait. I was just randomly killing things for no good reason at all". :/

Heh We planned an autumn (mid-April; our seasons are backwards) wedding, during a dry season, in one of the drier parts of an arid country; we were expecting "summery" weather, and an outdoor ceremony. And it rained. This is what wedding weather does

With a smart thermostat then you should have no problems at all - I doubt you'll need to spot heat unless you're planning on a very different heat profile to when you live there

[butterfly_muse]

Originally Posted by Discus

It's sort of exciting as a teenage boy, and then later, you grow up a bit and think "Wait. I was just randomly killing things for no good reason at all". :/

Heh We planned an autumn (mid-April; our seasons are backwards) wedding, during a dry season, in one of the drier parts of an arid country; we were expecting "summery" weather, and an outdoor ceremony. And it rained. This is what wedding weather does

With a smart thermostat then you should have no problems at all - I doubt you'll need to spot heat unless you're planning on a very different heat profile to when you live there

It rains a lot in the autumn here, so...we can have the ceremony inside if we have to. We'll just lose the money on the outdoor gazebo, but..*shrug*

More or less I'm just worried about the temp dipping during the day in the real cold weather when we're not there. I think the thermostat is auto set to kick on at 55 or 60 (or somewhere in between there) in the winter if the temperature gets that low. And we have to find a tolerable temperature for our cats, but given that they like to sleep under the covers and have fur, they're likely to be more comfy than the orchids.

[Lorraine]

One question although I might have missed the info...when you are gone will your place really be in the 70/80's all day and then drop to 50? Seems like when I lived in the north generally home temps were in the low 70's (heating costs) then a cooler night was of no consequence.

I don't know how large your collection is but maybe gather your guys together and drape a sheet over them so they have like a mini greenhouse effect to gradually adjust to the temp fluctuations. If it is a white sheet plenty of light still gets through. I do that outside when we have wind and lower than usual temps but use a heavier cover.

[butterfly_muse]

Originally Posted by Lorraine

One question although I might have missed the info...when you are gone will your place really be in the 70/80's all day and then drop to 50? Seems like when I lived in the north generally home temps were in the low 70's (heating costs) then a cooler night was of no consequence.

I don't know how large your collection is but maybe gather your guys together and drape a sheet over them so they have like a mini greenhouse effect to gradually adjust to the temp fluctuations. If it is a white sheet plenty of light still gets through. I do that outside when we have wind and lower than usual temps but use a heavier cover.

Given that it's November, it's really hard to tell. Weather here fluctuates sooo much in the fall, and with the whole climate change thing going on, the weather has been even more variable. Last autumn it was really nice, 70s-ish during the day, awesome....but like 39-40 overnight. Or it'd be 70s during the day and 50 overnight and then cold snap, and it would be 35 during the day and like 29 at night. O_O It really just depends on what stage of her period Mother Nature is on at that time of the year.

[Lorraine]

Originally Posted by Discus

Lorraine - good point, but even outdoors, it seldom goes from 80/90F to 40F overnight (i.e. it doesn't shift from "summer" straight into "winter") - there's a gradual seasonal increase and decrease (although of course it's day-by-day a little jagged [thanks, weather], the trend is fairly gradual).

Having a centrally heated house and then going away for a while switching the boiler off/very low is a bit like a sudden shift from summer into winter.

Great food for thought Discus. I wish the gradual temp was always the case.

Unfortunately we can be at 75/80 one day and a cold front slam us the next day and stick around for several days even a week. We have to be vigilant of the weather all the time and have plan A, B and C already thought out. Oh I just love Florida...It keeps me on my toes!

The suggestion made to gradually lower the temp prior to leaving is a good possibility.