How to identify Hard or Soft cane Dendrobium
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  #11  
Old 06-06-2007, 03:38 AM
quiltergal quiltergal is offline
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OK here's how they are grouped in the book I have. It's a direct quote.

Dendrobium: the major cultural groups, as classified by Rebecca Tyson Northern

Group I - deciduous - intermediate, warm in summer, cool in winter - winter rest - examples: D. nobile, D. chrysanthum, D. wardianum

Group II - deciduous or coriaceous and persistent - intermediate, warm all year - winter rest - examples: D. speciosum, D. aggregatum, D. findlayanum, D. heterocarpum, D. superbum, D. parishii, D. pierardii

Group III - persistent - intermediate, warm in summer, cool in winter - no rest, simply reduce in winter - examples: D. densiflorum, D. fimbriatum, D. thyrsiflorum, D. farmeri

Group IV - persistent - cool all year - short suspension early autum - examples: 'nigro-hirsute' group: D. bellatulum, Pedilonium group: D. secundum

Group V - persistent - intermediate - no rest or short rest after growth - examples: D. antilope (Ceratobium group) V and VI hybrids.

Group VI - persistent - warm - restrict twice - examples: D. phalaenopsis, D. bigibbum, D. superbiens


Soft canes certainly fall into group I, and hard canes into group VI. I have no idea how you would classify the rest of them. I have one from Group IV that is more similar to my group I nobile than my Group VI phal type. Gee have I muddied the waters enough, or shall I keep stirring?
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  #12  
Old 06-07-2007, 10:44 AM
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justatypn justatypn is offline
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Damnnnnnnnn....now I know why Tony hates them

The Depot have both types, many this time of year are phal types, nobiles like to sneak in in the later part of the winter. Very few and far between this year though.

I have had my share of dends some look like I should put to rest permanantly but it's so hard ( I'll be darn if they will win), but the fact of the matter is, rest or no rest, the ones that I have in my collection really did not show me any different signs being rested or awake during the winter months.

Guess it's back to the drawing board. The information in this thread surely sheds a new light on dend growing...thanks Sue for the link the societies breakdown and Terri for your breakdown...definitely a mind boggling culture...lets see we have a smiley for that one...
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  #13  
Old 06-07-2007, 12:54 PM
quiltergal quiltergal is offline
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With over 1400 different species no wonder it's confusing! I'm sure all 1400 of them don't fall neatly into any of the groups I-VI either.
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  #14  
Old 10-16-2010, 07:03 PM
Lilly B Lilly B is offline
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How to identify Hard or Soft cane Dendrobium Female
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Hello all. This is my first post although I must admit that I having been coming in and eavesdropping for months. I'm posting my first one here because I purchased my first Dendrobium where they had laid out a bunch of dead/dying and unmarked orchids. The Dendrobium looked like it was healthy so for a few bucks I thought, why not. She has rewarded me with two spikes of 12 buds each. I was wondering if she was hard or soft cane so I could care for her properly so I checked the board for an answer.From your answer I must have another mutt (2 rescue dogs in the house) because one spike is coming from the middle of the top of the two uppermost leaves and one is coming off of the cane. Now I'm not sure how I should care for it. Water, no water in the winter?
Sorry for this very long post. I'll get better, promise.
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  #15  
Old 10-16-2010, 08:01 PM
Orchid126 Orchid126 is offline
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How to identify Hard or Soft cane Dendrobium
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Flowers on the den nobile come up and down the cane. Flowers on the hard cane phal types come from a spike or spikes near the tip of the cane.
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  #16  
Old 10-16-2010, 09:46 PM
Lilly B Lilly B is offline
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How to identify Hard or Soft cane Dendrobium Female
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Thank you Orchid126. So since mine has spikes, it doesn't matter whether they are coming off of the cane or near the tip of the cane, it is a hard cane type, right? I will look up some pictures of a den nobile so I can see the flowers up and down the cane. I've only had Phals and Cattleyas before so I am really unfamiliar with the Dendrobiums.

I just looked up pictures of the den nobile and now I see what you mean by flowers on the cane. They are beautiful. I think I will have to invest in a den nobile. I am still waiting to see what the flowers on my den look like. Hoping that they are also beautiful. Will post pictures after they finally open. Seems they take a lot longer from spike to bloom than the phals do.

Last edited by Lilly B; 10-16-2010 at 10:47 PM.. Reason: Added to the message
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  #17  
Old 11-15-2017, 06:23 PM
bil bil is offline
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How to identify Hard or Soft cane Dendrobium
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Different types of Dens. inc winter treatment

http://www.orchidboard.com/community...endrobium.html
I have 1 phal type which is considered a hard cane, warm grower, no winter rest, 1 nobile which is a soft cane, cool grower, needs a winter rest, and a forumosum/cruentum hybrid that is a soft cane, intermediate grower, that likes reduced water & feeding in winter but not a true rest.

Den species
Den hybrid - Nobile type
Den Hybrid - Formosae type
Den hybrid - Phalaenopsis type - Solid colors
Den hybrid - Phalaenopsis type - Stripes
Den hybrid - Phalaenopsis type - Multiple Tones
Den hybrid - Nigrohirsute type (FYI: stems have black hairs)
Den hybrid - Latouria type
Den Hybrid - Callista type
Den hybrid - Spatulata type (FYI: antelope/twisted petals type)
Den - other than above
Den First Bloom Seedling - divisions and mericlones excluded
Den miniature - foliage less than 6 inches

OK here's how they are grouped in the book I have. It's a direct quote.

Dendrobium: the major cultural groups, as classified by Rebecca Tyson Northern

Group I - deciduous - intermediate, warm in summer, cool in winter - winter rest - examples: D. nobile, D. chrysanthum, D. wardianum

Group II - deciduous or coriaceous and persistent - intermediate, warm all year - winter rest - examples: D. speciosum, D. aggregatum, D. findlayanum, D. heterocarpum, D. superbum, D. parishii, D. pierardii

Group III - persistent - intermediate, warm in summer, cool in winter - no rest, simply reduce in winter - examples: D. densiflorum, D. fimbriatum, D. thyrsiflorum, D. farmeri

Group IV - persistent - cool all year - short suspension early autum - examples: 'nigro-hirsute' group: D. bellatulum, Pedilonium group: D. secundum

Group V - persistent - intermediate - no rest or short rest after growth - examples: D. antilope (Ceratobium group) V and VI hybrids.

Group VI - persistent - warm - restrict twice - examples: D. phalaenopsis, D. bigibbum, D. superbiens

Type I (deciduous, so-called nobile type) intermediate to warm in summer, cool to cold in winter, full winter rest. Examples: D. nobile, D. chrysanthum, D. wardianum.

Type II (deciduous) intermediate to warm all year, full winter rest. Examples: D. speciosum, D. aggregatum, D. findlayanum, D. heterocarpum, D. superbum (anosmum), D. parishii, D. pierardii.

Type III (persistent) intermediate to warm summer, cool in winter, no winter rest - simply reduce water. Examples: D. densiflorum, D. fimbriatum, D. thyrsiflorum, D. farmeri.

Type IV (persistent) cool all year. Short suspension of water early autumn. Examples: D. bellatulum, D. secundum.

Type V (persistent) Intermediate all year. No rest. Examples: D. antilope and hybrids of type V and type VI.

Type VI (persistent) warm growing all year. Restrict water twice during year. Examples: D. phalaenopsis, D. bigibbum, D. superbiens.

Soft canes certainly fall into group I, and hard canes into group VI. I have no idea how you would classify the rest of them. I have one from Group IV that is more similar to my group I nobile than my Group VI phal type.

In order to get a better understanding of Dendrobium "types", you must absolutely grasp that the genus Dendrobium is a very, very large genus of orchids containing anywhere between 1,200 to 1,500 species described by science, spread all throughout the Asian continent, Australia and its territories, as well as certain Indo-Pacific islands. These different "types" of Dendrobium taxonomically break this super-genus down into subgroups. Taxonomically speaking, these subgroups of Dendrobium have been designated scientific section names by orchid taxonomists. Hobbyists also tend to have their own common names for these subgroups of Dendrobium in place of the actual scientifically designated section name, (which is what you're aware of and referring to).

Each section of Dendrobium can have different cultivational needs from one another, but not always. Certain sections of Dendrobium will share some similar cultivational needs as each other.

Dendrobium species within the same section tend to have more similar, (not same, don't confuse the words "similar" and "same" with one another, these two words are not interchangeable in meaning), cultural needs to each other.

"Den-phal types" are orchids that are in the genus Dendrobium and section Phalaenanthe; when people are talking about these orchids they are usually referring to the species or hybrids of this group of Dendrobium. The reason why Dendrobiums in this section are referred to taxonomically as "Phalaenanthe" is because of the flowers in this group of Dendrobium resembling the flowers on a Phalaenopsis. If you're wondering why the 2 names look very similar to one another, it's because of the word "Phalaena", which is in reference to an outdated taxonomical name of certain moths. An example of a species that belongs to this section would be Dendrobiium biggibum.

"Antelope types" are usually referring to Dendrobium species or hybrids that have been classified within the sectionSpatulata. If you're wondering why these Dendrobium are named "Spatulata", you will have to recognize that the English word "spatula" is derived from the word "spatulata". The thing that probably reminded the taxonomist of a spatula was most likely the petals of the flowers on the species where they are relatively straight. This group of Dendrobium are the ones with petals where in some species they form spirals and point upwards like the horns of some antelope, (hence, hobbyists commonly referring to this group of Dendrobiums as "Antelope types"). On many of the species, the petals do not form spirals or do not form quite as many spirals, they are relatively straight and point upwards, again, like certain other species of antelope do. An example of Dendrobiums with upward pointing petals that spiral would be Dendrobium helix. An example of Dendrobiums with upward pointing petals that are relatively straight would be Dendrobium tangerinum.

"Dendrobium nobile types" is actually a misnomer. By hobbyist standards anything that resembles the speciesDendrobium nobile would fall under this "type", because this is what the vast majority of growers recognize as the mascot of Denrobiums within this section of Dendrobium. Taxonomically speaking, Dendrobiums in this subgroup belong to the section Dendrobium, (yeah, you read correctly, section Dendrobium, not "Nobile"). This section does include the species Dendrobium nobile, but it also includes lesser known species such as Dendrobium lituiflorum.

"Formosae types" is a subgroup of Dendrobiums that taxonomically belong to the section Formosae. The Latin name "Formosae" is actually referring to what is currently called Taiwan, (known in the past as Formosa), it is not referring to any kind of physical characteristic of the plants that have been clumped into this section. The section name was given in reference to the type species Dendrobium formosum, which was found in Taiwan. However, be aware that there are species within this section that are not only found in Taiwan, but they are also being found all throughout Asia, (such as India or Japan, for example). These orchids tend to have fine black hairs all over the canes. They usually don't have pseudobulbs. A couple examples of species that belongs to this section would be Dendrobium formosum andDendrobium longicornu.

Btw, there are other sections of Dendrobium, here are some other ones you may more commonly encounter:

- Aporum
- Calcarifera
- Callista
- Dendrocoryne
- Densiflora
- Latouria
- Oxypetalum
- Stachyobium

---------- Post added at 05:23 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:22 PM ----------

Then there's this.

file:///C:/Users/bil/repost/DendrobiumCulture.pdf
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