Too Much Time Tending Orchids?

[trdyl]

I would say about 6.5 hours per week on avaerage.

[Call_Me_Bob]

if going on ob and other orchid stuff on the internet, or in books, then thats alot

[susiep]

I have a little over 200 orchids now, one quarter inside and 3 quarters outside. I average 10 hours a week just checking and watering them. Then there are marathon days every few months of repotting, fertilizing, spraying for bugs, etc. Plus the countless hours on OB! Hehe (I really rather my family didn't know how much time I spend on orchids. They feel neglected enough already!)

[peeweelovesbooks]

Like Swamper before him, Carl has been knocked from the top spot by MissMolly with a truly impressive 80-90 hours per week! There is the bar ladies and gents, it has been set. Any challengers?

Not to be the fly in the ointment, but to make this determination, you would really have to compare how many orchids swamper, Carl and MissMolly have to see who really spends the most time. I could have one orchid and spend 10 hours on it, which I think would be significantly more per orchid than let's say 10 hours a week for 2000 orchids.

But, who's counting?

[goodgollymissmolly]

I'd agree that the person with one or two orchids spends the most time per plant. They are most likely to have little in the way of productivity improvements. They probably carry them (it) back and forth for watering and whatever. They also probably know the least because experience is a major part of learning the meaning of reference materials. If you haven't grown "moisture" loving and "dry" plants you have trouble relating to the meaning of those terms when you read them.

That doesn't mean these people aren't smart or involved. They might be just starting out in life or in plants or in orchids regardless of age. Many of them will quit, but the survivors will become experienced growers someday.

I would like to say that it is not how much time you spend, but what learning you do that counts the most. In my orchid society there are people who have had a few orchids for years and don't know squat and some new comers who are fast learners. There is some minimum time required, but it's the rate of knowledge improvement that counts in the end.

Join your local society and the AOS and attend shows and judgings. Face to face contact with successful growers is the way to learn. The internet is fine entertainment and there is some basic information available, but there is also much useless, misinformation. By meeting and talking to people whose plants and skills are right before your eyes you know who to believe and who to ignore. Electronic interactions are no substitute for knowing your sources. Good growing!

[peeweelovesbooks]

Originally Posted by goodgollymissmolly

I'd agree that the person with one or two orchids spends the most time per plant. They are most likely to have little in the way of productivity improvements. They probably carry them (it) back and forth for watering and whatever. They also probably know the least because experience is a major part of learning the meaning of reference materials. If you haven't grown "moisture" loving and "dry" plants you have trouble relating to the meaning of those terms when you read them.

That doesn't mean these people aren't smart or involved. They might be just starting out in life or in plants or in orchids regardless of age. Many of them will quit, but the survivors will become experienced growers someday.

I would like to say that it is not how much time you spend, but what learning you do that counts the most. In my orchid society there are people who have had a few orchids for years and don't know squat and some new comers who are fast learners. There is some minimum time required, but it's the rate of knowledge improvement that counts in the end.

Join your local society and the AOS and attend shows and judgings. Face to face contact with successful growers is the way to learn. The internet is fine entertainment and there is some basic information available, but there is also much useless, misinformation. By meeting and talking to people whose plants and skills are right before your eyes you know who to believe and who to ignore. Electronic interactions are no substitute for knowing your sources. Good growing!

You know, I agree with you for the most part. I've been in the hobby for 3 years now (which is admittedly a blink of an eye). I will tell you that the most I have learned is not from orchid societies or experienced growers, but through this message board and my own research and experimentation.

I joined a local orchid society for one year, and was excited because I thought, like you say, I was going to learn lots of new information and meet experienced growers who would share a wealth of information.

Not so.

1) I didn't learn ONE new thing that I didn't already know.

Mounting: been there, done that,
Fertilizing: been there, done that... most of the society members didn't even know what MSU was.
Potting: of course, dahling...
watering, etc. I kept waiting to learn ONE new bit of information and it just didn't happen.

2) Experienced growers: of course there were many. They all brought in their fantastic looking specimens for us to ooooooooooooh and ahhhhhhhhh over the plants.

But...there was no sharing of information or exchange of ideas. For the most part, I can tell you their attitude was one of " worship my growing skills." And, honestly, I'm not one to stand on ceremony or someone who is easily awed. So, I suppose you can say the myth of the "helpful experienced grower" is just that, a myth.

In the alternative, it was the "OMG I have every laelia out there, what do you have?" type of attitude. Equally uniterested in that. Not surprisingly, I cancelled my membership.

I think my society reflects the general attitude of local orchid growers generally.

3) I also have to disagree with the implication that having a smaller collection necessarily leads to having a narrow skill set. Some people are specialists by nature while others aren't.

So, for example, I am simply not interested in spending a) time b) money or c) plants in an attempt to know how a "dry grower" feels or a "cool grower" feels. Not only do they not fit my conditions, but I'm just not interested in the plants or building elaborate systems to mimic growing conditions.

To the contrary, I'd rather excel at growing a few genera rather than try and grow the full spectrum of orchids "well enough."

[goodgollymissmolly]

I'm sorry that was your experience. However, communications is a two way street. I've never found that talking peer to peer with a very experienced orchid person, or golf pro, or engineer, or anyone else is a problem. I think ythey tend to reflect what you project and vice versa.

If you ask a question and appear to listen, they usually respond favorably (and I agree there are exceptions). The biggest problem that I've seen with some beginners is they ask something and immediately start disagreeing with answer. The person thinks, "why did they ask?" I'm not implying you did that only that it's fairly common. Believe me when someone immediately starts with a dispute because they saw something on an orchid forum, the experienced person runs for cover.

I'm not trying to tell what to do or think, but my experience is much different from yours. Maybe it's where you live, maybe it's the way you started the conversation, and maybe the person you were talking to is just an ass. I have no idea. But you sure should not paint every experienced orchid hobbyist with same brush. Some are nice, a few are not. Try vendors , they usually have a personal investment in being nice. But be sure you pick one that knows something. Some of them are just plant retailers.

[peeweelovesbooks]

Originally Posted by goodgollymissmolly

I'm sorry that was your experience. However, communications is a two way street. I've never found that talking peer to peer with a very experienced orchid person, or golf pro, or engineer, or anyone else is a problem. I think ythey tend to reflect what you project and vice versa.

If you ask a question and appear to listen, they usually respond favorably (and I agree there are exceptions). The biggest problem that I've seen with some beginners is they ask something and immediately start disagreeing with answer. The person thinks, "why did they ask?" I'm not implying you did that only that it's fairly common. Believe me when someone immediately starts with a dispute because they saw something on an orchid forum, the experienced person runs for cover.

I'm not trying to tell what to do or think, but my experience is much different from yours. Maybe it's where you live, maybe it's the way you started the conversation, and maybe the person you were talking to is just an ass. I have no idea. But you sure should not paint every experienced orchid hobbyist with same brush. Some are nice, a few are not. Try vendors , they usually have a personal investment in being nice. But be sure you pick one that knows something. Some of them are just plant retailers.

I'm not saying every orchid hobbyist is the same, and I'm certainly not a social butterfly here. But, I expect common courtesy wherever I go. I don't know whether growing a specimen sized-cattleya or renanthera, or winning one or more AOS awards excuses people from that requirement, at least in their minds.

That's been my experience with one orchid society, which totally discouraged me from joining another.

Having said that, my other objections to your post remain.

[Call_Me_Bob]

Originally Posted by peeweelovesbooks

You know, I agree with you for the most part. I've been in the hobby for 3 years now (which is admittedly a blink of an eye). I will tell you that the most I have learned is not from orchid societies or experienced growers, but through this message board and my own research and experimentation.

I joined a local orchid society for one year, and was excited because I thought, like you say, I was going to learn lots of new information and meet experienced growers who would share a wealth of information.

Not so.

1) I didn't learn ONE new thing that I didn't already know.

Mounting: been there, done that,
Fertilizing: been there, done that... most of the society members didn't even know what MSU was.
Potting: of course, dahling...
watering, etc. I kept waiting to learn ONE new bit of information and it just didn't happen.

2) Experienced growers: of course there were many. They all brought in their fantastic looking specimens for us to ooooooooooooh and ahhhhhhhhh over the plants.

But...there was no sharing of information or exchange of ideas. For the most part, I can tell you their attitude was one of " worship my growing skills." And, honestly, I'm not one to stand on ceremony or someone who is easily awed. So, I suppose you can say the myth of the "helpful experienced grower" is just that, a myth.

In the alternative, it was the "OMG I have every laelia out there, what do you have?" type of attitude. Equally uniterested in that. Not surprisingly, I cancelled my membership.

I think my society reflects the general attitude of local orchid growers generally.

3) I also have to disagree with the implication that having a smaller collection necessarily leads to having a narrow skill set. Some people are specialists by nature while others aren't.

So, for example, I am simply not interested in spending a) time b) money or c) plants in an attempt to know how a "dry grower" feels or a "cool grower" feels. Not only do they not fit my conditions, but I'm just not interested in the plants or building elaborate systems to mimic growing conditions.

To the contrary, I'd rather excel at growing a few genera rather than try and grow the full spectrum of orchids "well enough."

i agree mostly with you.

i disagree what you said about experienced growers not being helpful. some people just naturally arent helpful. but some are. i met the nicest guy from an orchid society. he has thousands of plant, but that doesnt mean he was still VERY helpful and kind.

[jrodpad]

Really interesting discussion - I hardly know where to start. Let's see:

1) MissMolly - I completely agree with you on the hours per plant slicing of the data, I was just having a bit of fun with the whole "top spot" among the group and the dethroning of title holders. I was only looking at the data from a quantitative perspective and wasn't really making any qualitative judgments. I imagine it's not all that hard to rack up lots of hours with your collection when it numbers in the thousands. With a moderate or small collection there's surely a diminishing returns point - fussing over orchids is probably a good thing to a point, but there must be a tipping point where you wind up doing more harm than good (constantly misting, checking moisture levels, repotting, re-repotting, etc.). That's why I think the average is a more interesting/revealing number when there are lots of data points; while not at all scientific, at some level it puts all of the variables in check, large collections, small collections, retired people, people working full time, part time, people working from home, fussy people, laid back people, people with automated setups who are highly efficient, people who are inefficient, etc. I put the question out there in the first place because I'm completely obsessed with orchids and I've watched my own collection (and the time that it takes to maintain my collection) grow over the last year at an alarming rate. I thought that if I knew what the ballpark average was of the obsessed folks on the OB was, I could peer into the future and know what to expect. It might also help me avoid that diminishing returns point if I was way off the mark.

2) I find the whole on-line forum v.s. local orchid society debate completely fascinating. I can see merit in both sides. Are you a person that tends to learn more/more effectively from other people's demonstrations, Socratic dialogs, group discussions, etc. on the one hand, or from solo research, books, Internet, forums, experimentation on the other? I find myself swinging back and forth - lord knows I'm constantly scouring the Internet and participating in the OB whenever I have a few minutes during the day to jump on-line, but at the same time I'm a regular at an orchid grower's greenhouse on the weekends and know the staff by name. I would love to join my local orchid society and participate in meetings, but they meet at a time that doesn't work out with my work schedule (work's always getting in the way of my orchid hobby!). Also, so much has to depend on the individuals in the local orchid society and their own personalities and values, right? What are the chances that you're going to find a group of people in an orchid society that are as cool as the members of this board? Soooo unlikely - the people on this board are so supportive, so active, always willing to help out. It's my favorite resource, so far, for getting educated and keeping myself informed.

3) On a far less interesting note, with 22 data points, the average care has dropped a bit to 13.1 hours per week. No change in the title spot

Thanks again for the lively debate - and please keep posting weekly hours numbers!

- J

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