Removing an emerging Cymbidium flower spike to preserve energy for growth?

[ElliotLi]

I have a very small Cymbidium Winter Fire (only one growth so far) that is showing an emerging flower spike right now.

Is it a good idea to remove the spike in this very early stage to direct the plant to put energy back into growth?

Also I'm in the San Francisco bay area. The season is fall. I worry this late fall flower spike may not even be able to fully develop before the cold weather comes in (coldest we get in winter is around ~2 to 5C). This plant is in a garden bed outside and cannot be taken indoors.

Thanks! Any advice is welcome.

[Roberta]

Why would you want to keep your Cym from blooming? Fall/winter is its season! The plant "knows" what it's doing. It's not late with its spike, this is still early in the season. The plant is starting its spike now for its normal winter blooming, and will laugh at the chill. Enjoy the flowers. Growth happens in the spring and summer, flowers in the fall or mostly in winter.

If you want to know how tough Cyms are with regard to cold, take a look at this page from a commercial grower in the San Diego area during a winter chill that is still memorable:

Ice - the great freeze of 2007

That big orange Cym on the website was in a show 2 weeks later, none the worse for wear, along with others that had the same experience, and the flowers were still show-quality!

A Cymbidium that has been growing outdoors in your area is acclimated to cold nights. In fact, most of them need that fall chill to bloom! The California coast from San Francisco south to San Diego is one of the best climates in the world for Cyms. They are outdoor plants.

[ElliotLi]

Thanks, Roberta!

My idea of removing flowers comes from growing of fruit trees, where it's a common practice to remove the flowers from a very young tree so that they could redirect the energy to root and leaf growth. I wonder if anyone is doing this same practice for cymbidiums to promote young growth.

Thanks for sharing a post of the 2007 cold snap in San Diego! What a fascinating thing to read. I am aware of cymbidium could survive in the zone 9b outside and have a few mature cymbidium outside in the ground, but I haven't had small ones like this outside yet, and gotta admit I'm a little worried. But I guess they should be fine.

I do take all my ensifolium hybrids inside to overwinter though.

[Roberta]

Cym. ensifolium definitely needs to be warmer in winter than the rest of the Cyms. Some of the other Jensoa-section Cyms are cold-tolerant but not that one... But Cym Winter Fire is one of the standard-type Cyms. No need to "prune"... On a small plant, the flower spike will proabably be on the small side with just a few flowers. As the plant matures and grows more pseudobulbs, it'll get stronger and put on a better display. I looked it up... quite a beauty. Cyms like that don't need pampering, though. If it has a flower spike, it is sturdy enough to support it without having a bad effect on future growth.

Actually, Cym. ensifolium hybrids with standard Cyms (like Golden Elf, Chen's Ruby, Milton Carpenter) have cold-tolerance from the standard Cym parent. Cym. ensofolium the species is the fragile one.

[ElliotLi]

Thanks again, Roberta! You are as helpful as ever!

---------- Post added at 07:01 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:55 PM ----------

Originally Posted by Roberta

Actually, Cym. ensifolium hybrids with standard Cyms (like Golden Elf, Chen's Ruby, Milton Carpenter) have cold-tolerance from the standard Cym parent. Cym. ensofolium the species is the fragile one.

Yes.

I have a Cym. ensifolium from Asia that I'm wintering inside.

I also have a Cym. Chuleewon's Christmas '#1' from Southeast Asia, which is supposed to be a Cym. ensifolium, Cym. sinense, and Cym. insigne hybrid. I think all these three are somewhat sensitive to cold.

My other ensifolium hybrids have unknown lineage, so I just put them inside just to be safe. When I have more divisions I can try to overwinter them outside for a test.

[Roberta]

Originally Posted by ElliotLi

Yes.

I have a Cym. ensifolium from Asia that I'm wintering inside.

I also have a Cym. Chuleewon's Christmas '#1' from Southeast Asia, which is supposed to be a Cym. ensifolium, Cym. sinense, and Cym. insigne hybrid. I think all these three are somewhat sensitive to cold.

My other ensifolium hybrids have unknown lineage, so I just put them inside just to be safe. When I have more divisions I can try to overwinter them outside for a test.

I don't think Cym insigne is sensitive, but ensifolium and sinense are, so you're quite right to protect it. I think you can go somewhat by the "look" - if they look more like Asian Cyms, probably on the fragile side. If the other parent is a standard, the flowers are bigger, and probably OK. If you are in zone 9b you probably have to be a little more careful than I do... I'm in 10a. I do get the occasional frost (my Cyms and the rest of the orchids got through the freeze of 2007, not as cold as it was in Solana Beach but about a week of nights down to 32 deg F) A lot depends on what happens during the day... if it warms up, it is amazing what orchids will tolerate. And that is the usual pattern... when it is cloudy, it is not as cold.

[Ray]

I used to import about 500 “Chinese” cymbidiums a month from a grower in Taiwan - ensifolium, sinense, kanran, and goeringii.

They were grown there in 50/50 pumice and twigs, fed with nothing but diluted, spoiled milk, saw the 90’s with shade in summer, and snow and full sun in winter.

[ElliotLi]

Originally Posted by Roberta

I don't think Cym insigne is sensitive, but ensifolium and sinense are, so you're quite right to protect it. I think you can go somewhat by the "look" - if they look more like Asian Cyms, probably on the fragile side. If the other parent is a standard, the flowers are bigger, and probably OK.

Yeah this Cym. ensifolium, Cym. sinense, and Cym. insigne hybrid looks identical to a thin-leaf ensifolium, so I also think it might love a warm environment.

Originally Posted by Roberta

If you are in zone 9b you probably have to be a little more careful than I do... I'm in 10a. I do get the occasional frost (my Cyms and the rest of the orchids got through the freeze of 2007, not as cold as it was in Solana Beach but about a week of nights down to 32 deg F) A lot depends on what happens during the day... if it warms up, it is amazing what orchids will tolerate. And that is the usual pattern... when it is cloudy, it is not as cold.

Last winter, I don't remember seeing a single day below 40. It was super mild. Not sure how this year would turn out to be.

Originally Posted by Ray

I used to import about 500 “Chinese” cymbidiums a month from a grower in Taiwan - ensifolium, sinense, kanran, and goeringii.

They were grown there in 50/50 pumice and twigs, fed with nothing but diluted, spoiled milk, saw the 90’s with shade in summer, and snow and full sun in winter.

That's very interesting. Of all things, who would have thought they'd use spoiled milk! I'd think small plants out of the flask should be kept as clean as possible.