Phalaenopsis Gigantea - specialized care?!

[Roberta]

With moss, it tends to hold more moisture, and watering too frequently may crowd out the air. You generally don't want to let it get crispy-dry because then it tends to be too hard to re-wet. But what you use for a container makes a difference. Yes, a plastic pot with sphagnum may tend to stay too wet. But if you use a plastic basket, sphagnum may maintain the right amount of moisture even with frequent watering since it will dry out fast. Or, you might use sphagnum in a terracotta pot for heat-sensitive orchids such as pleurothallids... the moss stays damp and the clay pot soaks up some of that water which evaporates at the surface, cooling the roots. So first, you need to decide what is the objective for each type. Then adjust the medium to give you the result you seek.

With an automatic watering system, you can adjust the medium depending on the plant type so that when all get watered the same, the end result is appropriate. I think I described this in another recent post - my Cymbidiums and L. anceps both need high light so they are in the same area, with the same sprinklers. The Cyms are in small bark in plastic pots, and stay pretty wet, the L. anceps are mounted or in baskets with little medium, and dry out fast (like a couple of hours after watering). So they all get the same (frequent) watering but the result for each is what they want, and very different.

I have a lot of my hanging plants - especially Maxillariae and Oncidinae - in plastic baskets with sphagnum. They get watered every day or two (especially in hot weather), stay quite damp but also get plenty of air (as the water evaporates from the sphag, it is replaced by... you guessed it... air!)

As far as fertilizing is concerned, the "once weekly, weakly" idea still holds. Orchids need very little fertilizer, since they grow slowly - they use fertilizer minerals primarily for growing new tissue, they meet their energy needs (carbs) by photosynthesis. If you under-fertilize, the plants may grow more slowly than is optimum, but they aren't harmed. If you over-fertilize you can burn roots and do long-term damage. So err on the low side. If you increase fertilizer, do so gently, and wait to see if it makes any difference. Patience!

(For the record, I go through my growing area with a sprayer, applying a very dilute - 1/2 teaspoon per gallon MSU fertilizer, about every 2 weeks. For the few things that are growing fast and therefore need more than that, such as the Cymbidiums, and during the summer growing season the Catasetinae, I just give a top-dressing of time release fertilizer such as Nutricote, once in the spring to give a bit of extra boost to those plants)

[HiOrcDen]

Originally Posted by Ray

Phal. gigantea (note that, being a species, the g is lower case) is one of those hot growers, rarely, if ever seeing lows below about 70°F or so.

Growers note that it seems to like it slightly brighter than many phals.

If you want a first-hand, knowledgeable pro response, contact Peter Lin at Big Leaf Orchids.

Thank you for this! I was thinking of looking to buy from Big Leaf Orchids, Peter Lin... is he not the one well known for Novelty Phals, and I am guessing Gigantea? This would explain the name I would wager

---------- Post added 08-13-2023 at 12:31 AM ---------- Previous post was 08-12-2023 at 11:44 PM ----------

Originally Posted by Roberta

With moss, it tends to hold more moisture, and watering too frequently may crowd out the air. You generally don't want to let it get crispy-dry because then it tends to be too hard to re-wet. But what you use for a container makes a difference. Yes, a plastic pot with sphagnum may tend to stay too wet. But if you use a plastic basket, sphagnum may maintain the right amount of moisture even with frequent watering since it will dry out fast. Or, you might use sphagnum in a terracotta pot for heat-sensitive orchids such as pleurothallids... the moss stays damp and the clay pot soaks up some of that water which evaporates at the surface, cooling the roots. So first, you need to decide what is the objective for each type. Then adjust the medium to give you the result you seek.

With an automatic watering system, you can adjust the medium depending on the plant type so that when all get watered the same, the end result is appropriate. I think I described this in another recent post - my Cymbidiums and L. anceps both need high light so they are in the same area, with the same sprinklers. The Cyms are in small bark in plastic pots, and stay pretty wet, the L. anceps are mounted or in baskets with little medium, and dry out fast (like a couple of hours after watering). So they all get the same (frequent) watering but the result for each is what they want, and very different.

I have a lot of my hanging plants - especially Maxillariae and Oncidinae - in plastic baskets with sphagnum. They get watered every day or two (especially in hot weather), stay quite damp but also get plenty of air (as the water evaporates from the sphag, it is replaced by... you guessed it... air!)

As far as fertilizing is concerned, the "once weekly, weakly" idea still holds. Orchids need very little fertilizer, since they grow slowly - they use fertilizer minerals primarily for growing new tissue, they meet their energy needs (carbs) by photosynthesis. If you under-fertilize, the plants may grow more slowly than is optimum, but they aren't harmed. If you over-fertilize you can burn roots and do long-term damage. So err on the low side. If you increase fertilizer, do so gently, and wait to see if it makes any difference. Patience!

(For the record, I go through my growing area with a sprayer, applying a very dilute - 1/2 teaspoon per gallon MSU fertilizer, about every 2 weeks. For the few things that are growing fast and therefore need more than that, such as the Cymbidiums, and during the summer growing season the Catasetinae, I just give a top-dressing of time release fertilizer such as Nutricote, once in the spring to give a bit of extra boost to those plants)

Thank you again, especially for the fertilization advice! And thanks everyone. I will have to transform my fertilizing routine, along these parameters.

So I've got like a million follow up questions lol though I will keep it down to a few!

So with your sprinklers, how do you coordinate different schedules? You mentioned you water your Maxillariae and Oncidinae once per day or 2. Do you have different timers on different schedules on different or split hoses, or do you manually turn your sprinklers on and off?

What if you want to take a long trip... what is your procedure? My sister lives close but she was kind of stressed last trip we took and she's super busy most always!

I have even found a device that will feed fertilizer along with the sprinkler system attached to a hose. Would you find this useful at all? Or is manual fertilizing the way to go?

So, as far as slow release, I have these little green beads, maybe 1 or 2 millimeters. Will they work the same on bark chips or sphagnum moss? Do I administer the same amount? Should I try building up slowly to combine slow release and periodic liquid fertilizing, if this is advisable?

If I'm using liberal watering with sphagnum moss, does it have to be 100% New Zealand moss? I found that it was prohibitively expensive for anything but very expensive plants. I use Santa Barbara Super Moss; is this suitable for liberal watering?

Is it okay to use the same size Orchiata (small, though not the smallest size) for all of my plants? I am on a somewhat limited budget, to buy another size.. would it be a necessity for larger plants mohave bigger bark? Most of my orchids are medium to mini and even micro, though I do have a couple giants lol

Finally, would you care to suggest a specific type and/or brand of Orchid Baskets I should look for, maybe the name of a store (local, chain, or online) where I can get them? I have seen some on Amazon, and I'd like to know if they're proper and useful. I guess I will search your website too, @Roberta to see if you've got any pics of baskets...

Oh one more little thing, @Roberta and @Ray you have told me that steam distillation is wasteful and unnecessary. So is there a necessary benefit to the other types of filtration? If so, I will be sure to search @Ray's website again.

Apologies, guess I did not leave the questions under a million! lol hand @Estacion_Seca, wondering if you caught my questions...

Again, one and all!

[Ray]

HiOrcDen, let me throw out a couple of things to consider.

Concerning overwatering.

• Water does not cause root rot.
• Orchids do much of their gas exchange processes through their roots, unlike terrestrial plants that primarily do so through leaves.
• When we water, most pours right through the medium, but some is absorbed by the roots, some by the medium, and some is held by surface tension in the small voids between media particles.
• The smaller the voids, the more of that “bridging water” is held in place.
• If enough voids are clogged, air flow is restricted and the roots suffocate, die, and then rot.
• The coarser the medium particles, the less chance the surface tension can “do its evil thing”.

Concerning roots - you can’t just take a plant that has been grown dry and start watering it heavily, even if it’s in a coarse mix.

• As roots grow through cell differentiation at the growth tip, they “tailor” themselves to function optimally in that environment.
• Once they have grown, they cannot change.
• Change the environment, such as suddenly watering heavily when you have not been, changing the type of medium, or letting the medium age and change/decompose, and the existing roots will not longer be optimized for that different environment and will begin to fade away.

[Roberta]

For the sprinklers, I have different "zones", not only for scheduling, but there is a limit to how many sprinkler heads one can have for available water pressure. (We're talking about my whole yard...) That is precisely why I can take a vacation... the sprinkler system tales care of the routine watering.

Fertilizing is manual... if I don't get around to it, the plants aren't harmed. They just don't need that much! The "venturi' type of device to let one combine fertilizing and watering (like Hozon) requires high and consistent water pressure, and has a limitation of 50 foot hose. Doesn't meet my needs. One can get in injector type such as Dositron, but those are much more expensive, and require some plumbing. The manual approach works for me, gives me a chance to look at all of my plants.

If you need to choose one size of Orchiata, choose the medium ("Power") size. A good compromise. If you already have the small and want one more size, then the medium-large size ("Power+") would be the choice for the "other bag".

Here is the type of basket that I use... sizes from 4 inch to 10 inch. Where in coastal southern California do you live? If any place even slightly close to Yamada Co. in Gardena, just get them there... along with Orchiata and lots of other supplies. Save shipping.

Don't sweat the fertilizer. What you propose sounds like 'way too much.

Also, if you live near any orchid club (South Bay OS, Malibu OS, Orchid Club of Southern California, San Gabriel Orchid Hobbyists, etc) you should definitely join one - you will learn SOOO much from other, local orchid growers!

Most orchids grow just fine with city water. As I went farther down the "rabbit hole" I started to get more of the cloud forest species... these do grow better with pure water, so I installed a reverse osmosis system. (Orchids on my patio and in the greenhouse get RO, just one of the sprinkler zones) But if you are not growing Pleurothallids, or Sophronitis, or high-elevation Papua New Guniea Dendrobiums, you don't need it.

[HiOrcDen]

Thanks to all, once again!

So, are the Phalaenopsis Gigantea as prohibitively expensive as I have found?

On Ebay, I see them sold for $100 or more, for a seedling. Would this not be a few years away from blooming, or at least a few years from the 'gigantic' size? Maybe I am missing something?..

[Mugsie]

What a fantastic read on this topic. I just wanted to chime in and thank all of you for your expert advice and guidance in all aspects of orchid culture. It is people like you that make this a great forum. Thank you.

[Roberta]

Originally Posted by HiOrcDen

Thanks to all, once again!

So, are the Phalaenopsis Gigantea as prohibitively expensive as I have found?

On Ebay, I see them sold for $100 or more, for a seedling. Would this not be a few years away from blooming, or at least a few years from the 'gigantic' size? Maybe I am missing something?..

Keep looking... $100 for a seedling seems insane. You're located in southern California... come on out to Fascination of Orchids International Festival of Orchids and Exotic Plants next weekend (Sep 22-24). A couple of the vendors (Tropical Exotique and Wilson Orchids) have had Phal species in the past, not sure about gigantea (I have no advance knowledge of what vendors may bring this time, of course, depends on availability)

[HiOrcDen]

Originally Posted by Roberta

Keep looking... $100 for a seedling seems insane. You're located in southern California... come on out to Fascination of Orchids International Festival of Orchids and Exotic Plants next weekend (Sep 22-24). A couple of the vendors (Tropical Exotique and Wilson Orchids) have had Phal species in the past, not sure about gigantea (I have no advance knowledge of what vendors may bring this time, of course, depends on availability)

Thanks for this... sometimes on Amazon, Ebay, etc you will find someone listing an absurdly overpriced ripoff... like by 5 to 10 times a realistic selling price. I guess they are trying to capitalize on a naive buyer... one sale and I guess it pays off for them!

I will be at the Festival, with my parents likely, thank you again!

Would you happen to know whether some of the vendors might honor the AOS membership discount, of $25 off of a $75+ purchase? Just wondering, hopefully! X3

[Dalachin]

Giganteas do seem to be rather expensive right now. Last winter I picked up a nice looking mature one for $45 with free shipping from Plantswelltraveled on Etsy. Right now he has some for $80 (shipping included), and Big leaf has them for $85 (shipping not included).

I’m in the market for a new one myself— but my failure is too fresh to gamble on a gigantea at those prices. I grow many Phal species from Borneo and the Philippines in pots and mounts but that gigantea never thrived for me. I had it in a pot with bark and it languished, then I mounted it last spring and it never really took to the mount. This summer it lost all its leaves and died. I think the conditions in my grow shelves are pretty good for Phal growing, but I’m always tweaking and some plants don’t make it.

[camille1585]

A bit late to the party, I'm having some massive login issues.

Check out this thread for lots of information about groiwing Phal gigantea : Phalaenopsis gigantea - long term growing project

Mine really took off growing (if my conditions, ymmv) when I repotted it from bark to leca, in a net pot placed in a slightly larger plastic pot. It loves water but loves air around the roots too, so this method allows me to water very frequently. Leaves are now 15inches long and it's produced several spike nubbins, but they never developed into spikes with buds. Hoping with a bit more growth it will have enough dry mass to bloom soon. (note, I got it as a tiny seedling around 12 years ago or so!)