Phalaenopsis amabilis hybrids - care and root zone moisture.

[MateoinLosAngeles]

Recently, I saw Dustin from Here but not posting about a Phal amabilis hybrid he decided to deflask early since the plant didn't seem to like the constant moisture, even having the roots growing upwards.

I've been personally struggling with some Phal. amabilis hybrids in semi-hydro. The plants seem to do okay but not fully embrace S/H as other Phals do for me. They also notoriously want to escape the pot. I even have some that exhibit the same "upwards growing" of the roots, pretty much growing vertically and upwards outside of the pot.

All my S/H Phals are on heat mats, and temperature is monitored. These Phal. amabilis hybrids are together in an area that reads highs of 78ºF and lows of 70ºF, humidity fluctuations read min of 46% and a max of 68%. Other Phals do great for me in S/H, although the names I have for these hybrids don't seem to have been registered with the RHS, and I can't tell their ancestry. Phal bellina and violacea do great, although I keep them in pots with a pretty high reservoir and "evaporation barriers" in order to maintain their temperatures in the 80s.

I can't see anything on Jay Fahl's website or the Bakers sheets suggesting that amabilis is particularly wetness resentful. The comment seemed surprising given that it's also found in Borneo, and some of those Phals are the most moisture-loving ones, thriving in constant even moisture and heat.

Does anyone have suggestions for Phal. amabilis or a deeper understanding of their relationship with moisture, especially in the root area?

[Ray]

Is it possible you are misinterpreting your observations?

As far as I’m aware, plants that grow roots outside of the medium aren’t avoiding the medium as much as they are reaching out for more mechanical stability.

Don’t forget that the roots that are in the medium are the primary collectors of water and nutrition for the plant, and if they “don’t like” the conditions, they’ll simply die.

One might also argue that they are reaching out to gather more nutrition, but having abused my plants with any number of variations in formula, frequency and concentration, I have never seen it make a difference to aerial root growth.

[MateoinLosAngeles]

I really didn't come to this question from my own observations, but rather from this post by Here But Not / Dustin, whom I believe some people on the forum follow as well.

I've messaged him asking what did he mean by Phal. amabilis "loathing wetness" to the point that he had to deflask his seedling early. His observation made me think of something I have been observing myself. I have about 6 of these hybrids that are 85% Phal amabilis which I bought from a sale (and I use them as my guinea pigs). Unlike other Phalaenopsis hybrids (not to mention Oncidinae and Paphs...), they don't seem to thrive as readily in S/H despite nearly identical conditions. My observation is not much about the roots escaping or the plants having aerial roots as of the roots that happily grew into the LECA, or even the reservoir, will seemingly rot without warning. The plants will have a disproportionate amount of aerial roots, with pretty much none growing into the medium, and some roots that initially grow into the medium will "pivot" and start to grow vertically and up, which is similar to what Dustin describes in his post.

Basically, I grow two types of Phalaenopsis, those in the Polychilos subgenus that I keep moist, warm/hot year-round, with no exceptions. And then those in the Phalaenopsis subgenus, most of these being hybrids, with some in S/H and others in bark, grodan cubes, and perlite. None, including those in bark, dry out, but the ones in bark seem more robust and eagerly take over the pot. The cool-spikers in S/H seem to do fine but do not thrive in my conditions and even inexplicably lose roots to rot.

So this has made me wonder if there's a clear consensus about whether Phal amabilis loathes wetness and not drying out or what else other people observed in this and other cool-spiking species. I wonder whether S/H might be too constantly moist for them.

[Roberta]

I don't grow that many Phals... some hybrids "followed me home" and seem to do fine in medium bark (rather generic, really don't care much about the fine points of conditions) I think Phal schillerians is the only section Phalaenopsis species that I grow, have several, in baskets with either bark (larger ones) or sphag (smaller ones) The rest are section Polychilos (cornu-cervi, hieroglyphica, mannii, pulchra, speciosa, tetraspis), are either in baskets or mounted, all the roots tend to go wherever. The ones with the wildest roots do the best. All in flimsy not-well-regulated greenhouse (so humid, watered every 2 days for about 2 minutes by sprinklers, lowest temperature around 60 F but aim for a little higher, fans running 24/7) So I don't know if this has any useful information for your very different conditions, but I do find that these Phal species seem to do better under conditions where their roots do dry out (escape from whatever medium they start in). Qualitative and undisciplined.

[estación seca]

Try keeping them warmer.

[MateoinLosAngeles]

Originally Posted by Roberta

The rest are section Polychilos (cornu-cervi, hieroglyphica, mannii, pulchra, speciosa, tetraspis), are either in baskets or mounted, all the roots tend to go wherever. The ones with the wildest roots do the best. All in flimsy not-well-regulated greenhouse (so humid, watered every 2 days for about 2 minutes by sprinklers, lowest temperature around 60 F but aim for a little higher, fans running 24/7)

This is very helpful, Roberta. I'm always jealous of growers who can keep their Phals mounted or in baskets!

I'm doing a little bit more research, and I might experiment with letting some of these experience more of a wet/dry cycle.

Something to note that I also found interesting: today as I was cleaning the growing area I noticed 4/6 have initiated a spike, I happened to turn off the heat mats on these amabilis hybrids in early June. Plus, one that has been in spike for about two-three months, buds are slowly approaching maturity. The last one is just hanging out, but maybe seeing its sisters in bloom will inspire her.

[Ray]

Originally Posted by MateoinLosAngeles

I really didn't come to this question from my own observations, but rather from this post by Here But Not / Dustin, whom I believe some people on the forum follow as well.

Personally, I have issues with taking Dustin’s opinions and observations with anything less than a ton of salt.

There was a period of time, for example, where he was quite belligerent in showing his ignorance while nay-saying S/H culture, professing that (paraphrasing) “even the guy that invented it doesn’t use it any more”, which, of course, I still do.

In all fairness, he did apologize after I called him out, but that did leave me less-accepting of his “wisdom".

[MateoinLosAngeles]

Yikes, I recently saw a video by Miss Orchid Girl on S/H (Link) that also mentioned you. Still, instead of featuring your website, it simply featured a screenshot of a Google search for "First Rays," she also said that she didn't know what First Rays was about since "she wasn't in the US," yet she's been mentioning you for years and has no problem endorsing RepotMe, a borderline scam selling hardware store products at luxury prices, which is also based in the US.

Maybe someone should consider sending checks if they want people not to criticize them gratuitously. I thought decency was a choice. Perhaps, what it was all along was the name of a bank! :P

Whatever it is, it's a shame that people feel the need to criticize others for the sake of doing so, especially when S/H is a technique that anyone can use with materials easily found anywhere, and by reading your website, people get a lot of accurate information, that is based on science, for free. In contrast, other outlets share "opinions" as truths.

You put it very well in one of your articles where you say something along the lines of What do these different perspectives have in common? That people have found success using them! , which is an encouraging message to keep searching, keep learning, and keep experimenting.

For example, you've often shared that you can't keep a bellina in S/H, yet, I couldn't be happier with the results of S/H on my bellina. Paraphrasing George Orwell "To see what is in front of one's nose needs a constant struggle." One has to continue to observe and search, but what works for someone in Alberta might not work for someone in Los Angeles.

Having said that, I will test one of these cool-spiking amabilis hybrids in chunky bark+perlite and experiment with letting it get closer to drying out. See if that makes any difference. These are such slow-growing plants anyway that it would be foolish for someone to attempt to reach conclusions overnight.

[Ray]

I responded to Miss Orchid Girl's video, so there is no contention there, whatsoever.

Her problem was that the LECA she was able to find locally has a high alkalinity, so despite any effort on her part, the pH within the pot continued to increase steadily, essentially poisoning her plants over time.

I don't blame her for abandoning that.

[tmoney]

howdy,

we only have one amabalis seedling (or nbs plant), and yeah, compared to other species seedlings of comparable size the amabalis has new roots going every which way. seems to like it with the same conditions as our other polychilos (and other subgenera of phals). so, cannot say, other than our experience with phals in s/h has been more challenging than with other genera, specifically paphs.

best of luck! im sure with a little time they will be just fine...