Starting from Bulbs

[HiOrcDen]

Originally Posted by Roberta

Ah... Habenaria and Orchis (the naked man) and Ophrys do grow from bulbs (tubers)
Those terrestrials have a definite dormant period. Habenaria tends to be a summer bloomer, so it is probably starting to sprout... get it potted up right away - sphagnum or small bark work well. Wen dormant in winter, a bit of water but much less until they sprout in the spring. The European terrestrials like Orchis and Ophrys are just going dormant now. Pot those in a mix that is about 80% inorganic (I use pumice) and the rest can be small bark and/or potting soil. Then keep them dry through the summer, start watering around October.

The Europeans will be fine outside for you. Habenaria depends on which ones... Hab. medusa is a warm grower. But Hab. radiata actually needs to get down to frost in winter (I have tried but not succeeded with it, not cold enough in coastel So. Cal) Hab. dentata needs winter cool but not serious cold and that one I have succeeded with.

Thanks! How small of bark will work best? I am looking at Orchiata 1/8", and Orchiata 3-6mm 'Precision'...

And as for pumice, should I sift to 1/8" or so, or perhaps is a smaller variety necessary and available? I have received plants which seem to have very small pumice...

[Roberta]

I use 3/8 inch pumice for my Mediterranean terrestrials - get it on Amazon. It is quite clean, few "fines", no need for sifting. I just use a very little bit of generic seedling bark with the potting soil (like cactus mix) So of the 20% organic part, maybe 1/3 of that is cheapie bark (like I use for my Cyms) and 2/3 soil. (I don't measure so can't be precise) Hard, long lasting bark like Orchiata not needed, or particularly useful - you want something that will hold some water.

[HiOrcDen]

Originally Posted by Roberta

I use 3/8 inch pumice for my Mediterranean terrestrials - get it on Amazon. It is quite clean, few "fines", no need for sifting.

Wow, so you use pumice that large for pseudo/bulbs/tubers?

Oh, I imagine the 20% small bark or potting mix will maintain moisture well enough?..

Should these bulbs and so forth receive fertilizer? Also, should they have shallow and wider containers?

[Roberta]

Originally Posted by HiOrcDen

Wow, so you use pumice that large for pseudo/bulbs/tubers?

Yes. In nature, the Mediterranean terrestrials that I grow live in poor, rocky soil. Think of Greece or Turkey. Summer is baking-hot, no significant rain. (Sound familiar?) During the growing period (winter) I water daily or every other day (unless it happens to rain) and the mix holds sufficient water.

For pots, I use regular-depth pots. Doesn't matter, I put the tubers maybe an inch down, don't need to be deep. When they multiply, I go to larger pots to accommodate them.

I fertilize with my other orchids when they are growing. So they get a little, not much. Some nutrients also come from the potting soil. Again, think of where they live... not a lot of organic in the soil so little in the way of nutrients.

Pecteilis radiata is likely to not grow for you even if you get the bog mix and watering right... it also needs a cold winter (which it gets where Subrosa lives - USDA zone 6b is a whole lot different than 10a...)

[estación seca]

Most people successful with Pecteilis radiata overwinter the dug-up, bare tubers on just-damp sphagnum, vermiculite or perlite in a baggie or plastic container in the refrigerator, not freezer.

[HiOrcDen]

Originally Posted by Roberta

Yes. In nature, the Mediterranean terrestrials that I grow live in poor, rocky soil. Think of Greece or Turkey. Summer is baking-hot, no significant rain. (Sound familiar?) During the growing period (winter) I water daily or every other day (unless it happens to rain) and the mix holds sufficient water.

For pots, I use regular-depth pots. Doesn't matter, I put the tubers maybe an inch down, don't need to be deep. When they multiply, I go to larger pots to accommodate them.

I fertilize with my other orchids when they are growing. So they get a little, not much. Some nutrients also come from the potting soil. Again, think of where they live... not a lot of organic in the soil so little in the way of nutrients.

Pecteilis radiata is likely to not grow for you even if you get the bog mix and watering right... it also needs a cold winter (which it gets where Subrosa lives - USDA zone 6b is a whole lot different than 10a...)

Originally Posted by estación seca

Most people successful with Pecteilis radiata overwinter the dug-up, bare tubers on just-damp sphagnum, vermiculite or perlite in a baggie or plastic container in the refrigerator, not freezer.

So, how long should the Radiate tuber stay in the refrigerator? Do you do basically a cold stratification, and wait until it starts growing inside the fridge?

[Roberta]

I leave it to Subrosa to answer your question. But remember, the time to chill the tuber is winter. Now is the time when it should start growing... I am assuming that you have it now, you need to find out how to grow it in spring.

[HiOrcDen]

Originally Posted by Roberta

I leave it to Subrosa to answer your question. But remember, the time to chill the tuber is winter. Now is the time when it should start growing... I am assuming that you have it now, you need to find out how to grow it in spring.

Originally Posted by HiOrcDen

So, how long should the Radiate tuber stay in the refrigerator? Do you do basically a cold stratification, and wait until it starts growing inside the fridge?

With tubers in general, do you keep in the same light levels and temperatures as grown plants? Do you fertilize at all? Do you water thoroughly and wait till nearly dry, or maintain moderate level, or perhaps more towards wetter?

Also I wonder if it's possible to place the tuber in the refrigerator now, even if it is not on schedule, until it shows growth is triggered? Maybe that would kind of rearrange the natural seasonal phases to trigger growth? I think this cold stratification works with tree and shrub seeds, out of season.

And I am worried a bit that though it is Spring now, and you say I should plan for that, that it may not grow if it was not in frost during winter, so that perhaps I should bet on the cold stratification?

---------- Post added at 06:17 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:04 PM ----------

Originally Posted by Roberta

I leave it to Subrosa to answer your question. But remember, the time to chill the tuber is winter. Now is the time when it should start growing... I am assuming that you have it now, you need to find out how to grow it in spring.

Originally Posted by HiOrcDen

So, how long should the Radiate tuber stay in the refrigerator? Do you do basically a cold stratification, and wait until it starts growing inside the fridge?

Originally Posted by estación seca

Most people successful with Pecteilis radiata overwinter the dug-up, bare tubers on just-damp sphagnum, vermiculite or perlite in a baggie or plastic container in the refrigerator, not freezer.

Sorry I messed up the quoting! So I ask you both, the above...

[Subrosa]

As I said previously, my success at wintering radiata indoors has been poor. In the ground mine went down for dormancy in late October or so and broke the surface in mid May. The winter was pretty mild for here, with the lowest temperature getting down to around 10°F. Chilly weather did persist rather late, with our last hard freeze happening in early April.

[Roberta]

Originally Posted by HiOrcDen

With tubers in general, do you keep in the same light levels and temperatures as grown plants? Do you fertilize at all? Do you water thoroughly and wait till nearly dry, or maintain moderate level, or perhaps more towards wetter?

There's no "general" ... different genera have different needs. With regard to the Pecteilis radiata, I can only wish you luck.

With regard to the Mediterranean tubers, just pot them up, put them where you can totally ignore them until October or so. Bone dry, normal light (though light probably irrelevant). In October, once the nights are reliably cool, you can start light watering (start by just moistening the medium, then increase a little, maybe twice a week. Then, once they sprout you can water thoroughly and keep them wet (all that pumice keeps them from being soggy, you can't overwater them), fertilize with the rest of your orchids. Once they start sprouting they definitely need good light. (In my yard they don't get as much as would be ideal, in fall/winter the house shades the yard... I found a spot where they get 3-4 hours of good sun a day, I can't do any better, they still do perform) But the Mediterranean terrestrials are really a natural for southern California. Their pattern matches ours quite well.

In coastal southern California we can grow lots of different kinds of orchids with a little adaptation, but there are still a few limits. It's a lot easier to add heat than to generate serious cold. Forget Cypripediums... not going to happen - there are a few native California Cyps that grow in the Sierras but don't adapt to captivity. Cyps from other parts of the country are just not going to make it, they have to experience significant frost. (Tulips don't do well either... we can maybe grow them for a season or two with the refrigerator treatment, but that's it)