Floppy limp 2 leaves.

[early]

I have 5 types of orchids and about 25 plants. All are healthy, even one that a neighbor neglected to water last summer, It is still puny but growing a new leaf.

I have one problem orchid, a Phal, that has no other symptoms other than droopy leaves and no new growth but has a two roots that are still healthy, About a month ago repotted and removed any brown rotted roots.

In the several months, I have had orchids, I have never had one crump. I read where even longtime experts here sometimes lose an orchid.

Is this the luck of the draw or am I missing something or doing something wrong?

Any suggestions appreciated

[fishmom]

A whole plant picture would be helpful. I can't remember what you are doing to provide humidity, but living where you do, that might be a concern. A warm, moist atmosphere--and time--may spur some growth.

[early]

Originally Posted by fishmom

A whole plant picture would be helpful. I can't remember what you are doing to provide humidity, but living where you do, that might be a concern. A warm, moist atmosphere--and time--may spur some growth.

My bloomers are in a small room with 40 to 65 % and cool in 60s at night, up to 70* or more in daytime. Overhead skylight and plenty of air circulation.

I think I have had the Phal almost a year. It was blooming when I bought her. Only plant with all the same conditions that is not perky. all in s/h
4th photo is my new seedling zygo debbie de mello one month's growth from much smaller.

[SouthPark]

Early - hi there! Roughly how long has that phal been in semi-hydro for?

I haven't ever tried semi-hydro before ....... and I recall something about the plant needing to transition to semi-hydro ------ and that transition involves something like old roots dying off, and the newly devloped or developing roots become adapted or accustomed to the relatively wet conditions associated with semi-hydro.

Check the roots to see if the roots look ok. If they're soft or mushy, or not a healthy looking colour, then could consider washing the roots, and temporarily grow this orchid in regular media (eg. 8 mm average diameter scoria pieces).

[Ray]

It is simply dehydrated.

From your description, this is the scenario my mind has conjured up:

It started with bad mix and bad roots. You took care of that, but moved it into a different pot environment, so the existing, good roots can no longer function optimally. The roots aren’t growing very quickly because your cool temperatures (for a phal) don’t favor it and the moist LECA is exacerbating that through evaporative cooling.

When roots grow, they tailor themselves on a cellular level to function optimally in that environment. Once grown, they cannot change. Move them into a different environment and they are suboptimal and will start to fail.

I disagree with Southpark’s “temporary” measure, as the roots that grow in that will also be suboptimal once moved again.

Instead, I suggest that you keep it in very humid and very warm conditions, in the current pot, as that seems to be your choice for growing them.

You might want to give this a read.

[SouthPark]

Thanks Ray! I'm currently not disagreeing with my own recommendation - as I recall somebody once mentioning to me that an orchid that lives in a semi-hydro or even an FWC environment can very easily transition to a regular media environment.

I haven't tried that out for myself though. I assumed that a plant can very readily go from FWC/SH to regular media without issues. But the reverse is not the same ----- ie. regular to SH/FWC.

For this particular orchid that doesn't appear to be handling the situation well (for some reason), the assumption is that putting it back in a regular medium for recuperation time might be beneficial.

On the other hand, if this orchid can recover (if given enough time) in its present SH condition, then that'll be really nice!

Ray - you'll likely be the best person to ask. Is it true what that person once told me (about orchids can readily transition from SH or FWC to regular media without issues)? Thanks Ray.

[early]

Originally Posted by SouthPark

Early - hi there! Roughly how long has that phal been in semi-hydro for?

I haven't ever tried semi-hydro before ....... and I recall something about the plant needing to transition to semi-hydro ------ and that transition involves something like old roots dying off, and the Jnewly devloped or developing roots become adapted or accustomed to the relatively wet conditions associated with semi-hydro.
.

Hi SouthPark, This is a NoID, Phal, And I put her in semi hydro as soon as I learned about LECA on another site and asked Ray about it there. All my plant are in S/H

[SouthPark]

Hi Early! Thanks for those details! Go with Ray's recommendation Early, as all your orchids are S/H.

If the temperatures are a bit low, then it's possible that Ray's recommendation about raising the growing temperature a bit will sort things out. Root temperature for some orchids being too cold (or even just orchid temperature) ---- cold and wet ---- can impact the growth processes negatively.

Anyway - we all want to see your orchid recover really well!

[early]

Originally Posted by Ray

It is simply dehydrated.

From your description, this is the scenario my mind has conjured up:

It started with bad mix and bad roots. You took care of that, but moved it into a different pot environment, so the existing, good roots can no longer function optimally. The roots aren’t growing very quickly because your cool temperatures (for a phal) don’t favor it and the moist LECA is exacerbating that through evaporative cooling.

When roots grow, they tailor themselves on a cellular level to function optimally in that environment. Once grown, they cannot change. Move them into a different environment and they are suboptimal and will start to fail.

Instead, I suggest that you keep it in very humid and very warm conditions, in the current pot, as that seems to be your choice for growing them.

You might want to give this a read.

Thanks Ray, It seems I don't remember every thing I read here as well as I did as a young nurse. Learning about orchids is taking me a long time.
I used the KelpMax method on a mini phal that was not watered properly when I was in Colorada last summer.
Her puny leaves are not growing but she has a healthy new leaf.
As for this floppy leafed standard Phal, after re-reading you KelpMax instruction, I made up a gallon, unpotted it, and put it in the solution. The two roots I seem to remember two weeks ago, were gone and all I have left are the white strings . I staked and positioned her half way up the stalk, several mm from the crown, tented it with plastic, left a opening, and put her under a light to warm up. I will order a seedling heat mat today, I need it for some seeds of other plants also, so I will get two.

and I will be patient. I have read all this before but there is so much to learn, I had forgotten. Thanks for steering me to LECA which works very well here in dry NM. That is the first thing I do..repot..as soon as I get them home.

---------- Post added at 09:01 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:53 AM ----------

Originally Posted by SouthPark

Hi Early! Thanks for those details! Go with Ray's recommendation Early, as all your orchids are S/H.

If the temperatures are a bit low, then it's possible that Ray's recommendation about raising the growing temperature a bit will sort things out. Root temperature for some orchids being too cold (or even just orchid temperature) ---- cold and wet ---- can impact the growth processes negatively.

Anyway - we all want to see your orchid recover really well!

I will post a series of photos I save, from today and when I repot her into S/H and after she starts to grow new root in a few months, and again when she starts to recover and shoot out a new leaf.
Of all my phals, I only have one or two that are not putting out one or two new leaves. But the leaves they have are very health.
Heat is not going to be a problem soon. it will be 80* F
this week here. Last week it was below freezing at night outside. sigh. My small room where I have all my bloomers and some other growers, will not be in cooled air, just the fan for circulation, Nothing direct. but will still be in the 70s day and night.

[Ray]

Originally Posted by SouthPark

Is it true what that person once told me (about orchids can readily transition from SH or FWC to regular media without issues)? Thanks Ray.

I think that how well a plant takes to any change is determined by the degree if difference between the old and new conditions.

For example, a plant in soppy sphagnum takes to S/H very easily, as it’s actually a “step upwards” being more airy while still moist. I can’t speak for water culture, as I’ve never tried it.

I think that for some folks and their household conditions, the change from S/H to a bark mix might be easier than the reverse, due to the fact that there will be less evaporative cooling in the bark mix. My “roots being suboptimal” concept still applies though.