Can someone diagnose this phal.? Weird black color on the roots.

[K.O.]

This is a phal. tying shin baby smile. I dont know whats wrong with her but ive been fighting with her ever since i brought her. I had to repot like 4 times because she was acting up in the medium, or becoming dehydrated. I think shes growing more roots but the top roots are black but still firm as you can see. Also shes dropping another leaf and the aerial roots are shriveled up to a certain point which is weird.

[Roberta]

The first photo shows good roots... at that point, you needed to let be, and either rehydrate or grow a good new leaf. Remember, with no roots a plant can't take up water... it can be nurtured to keep humidity up (like a loose plastic bag) But if you keep messing with it, it does not get a chance to establish. The black does look like rot (like the roots stayed too wet) A systemic fungicide may help (others on the forum will have to advise, I have no experience with them, not having the need) No peroxide or cinnamon on the roots - those can work on the upper part of the plant, but will damage roots.

Remember that orchids don't do anything fast (don't even die fast usually) So when you do something like repotting, you then have to step back for a few months. Repotting 4 times in a short period is not conducive to long term survival.

[early]

Originally Posted by Roberta

No peroxide or cinnamon on the roots - those can work on the upper part of the plant, but will damage roots.

I have a question re peroxide on root. I have never seen it recommended here on the post I have read, but many places I visited before I found OB, said to use it after removing root rot when repotting. A few months ago when I went into S/H I did spray some roots with it, never used it above media. Did I damage the plants I used it on?

[K.O.]

Ive actually used hydrogen peroxide on her roots before. I got this plant around may of 2019 and it only started giving me issues around august 2019 and so began my struggle. I had two other phals that got dehydrated but they bounced back pretty quickly. I know not all plats are the same though. Im leaving it alone because i saw petruding new roots and i feel the top most leaf is getting firmer i just dont want it to relapse or something. Also im afraid of using any harsh chemicals on any of my orchids so is their an alternative to fungicide?

[Roberta]

Peroxide (at least at the 3% that comes in the bottle) can definitely damage roots - roots have microsopic hairs and lots of surface area. The fizzing that peroxide does is tissue being dissolved. Not something that you want to do to a root. Yes, you'll see the advice to use it in videos, etc. on the 'net ... but there's lots of bad advice out there.

K.O., a fungicide (a chemical formulation that goes after specific fungal/bacterial problems) that is designed to be used on plants is a lot less harsh than peroxide that basically burns (oxidizes) tissue. Yeah,peroxide kills the bad stuff, but it is non-specific and kills good stuff too.

[K.O.]

Wow thanks for that! I guess i have been misinfomrmed because when I was doing research on treating roots, they suggested using peroxide 3% over fugicide because it was toxic to people etc.

[Roberta]

Originally Posted by K.O.

Wow thanks for that! I guess i have been misinfomrmed because when I was doing research on treating roots, they suggested using peroxide 3% over fugicide because it was toxic to people etc.

There's a lot of "chemophobia" out there... If you use a fungicide don't drink it ... Wash hands after using, same for pesticides.

Beware of dihydrogen monoxide ... If you breathe it, could be toxic.

[K.O.]

LMFAO OBVIOUSLY NOT DRINK IT xD maybe they werent careful and got it on their skin. But ok thank you! ^.^

[aliceinwl]

What are your temperatures like? There are some hybrids with hot growers in their background that just don’t seem to thrive under room temperature conditions (low 70s and cooler). And, if this is your temperature range, semi hydroponic growing will make things even cooler in the root zone. If your conditions are on the cool side, you may want to consider a seedling heat mat.

[SouthPark]

The forum members comments are fantastic.

Just adding (if not mentioned already) - check the roots down in the depths of the pot - to ensure they're not taking a bad turn. Being too dry is an issue, but being too wet with not enough oxygen in the water can also be an issue.

So aside from providing recommended growing temperature and lighting level ----- also take a look at the drainage side of things of the orchid pot. Provide good drainage.

Also consider the outer pot or decorative pot that has no holes - if there is one. If that outer pot inhibits air-flow and impedes good drainage, then consider removing the outer pot - at least temporarily. This is only assuming there is an outer decorative pot.

Also - if not already - grow the orchid in an area that has some air-movement ----- avoid growing in a still-air environment.



---------- Post added at 06:31 AM ---------- Previous post was at 06:19 AM ----------

Originally Posted by early

I have a question re peroxide on root. I have never seen it recommended here on the post I have read, but many places I visited before I found OB, said to use it after removing root rot when repotting. A few months ago when I went into S/H I did spray some roots with it, never used it above media. Did I damage the plants I used it on?

Early - hydrogen peroxide didn't ever kill any of my orchids when I decided to try spraying my orchids (roots, stem, leaves and all) of any incoming orchids that came via mail/shipping. But I did see a pattern - where the growth/development of the orchid was set back - as in they didn't appear to do much growing for quite a while after this H2O2 treatment. This was 3% H2O2.

However, I now do a mancozeb spray treatment instead for incoming orchids, which I notice doesn't do anything bad at all to any of the orchids.

I think the main thing to consider for anyone is - first see if there is a pattern when applied to 'healthy orchids' (ie. setback in growth). And - if that is consistently noticed - then also have to consider what could happen when applied to an unwell orchid.

For rotting issues, using a recommended systematic fungicide (not mancozeb, which isn't a systematic one) would be a nice way to go - such as agri-fos (or equivalent like aliette) and thiomyl (eg. cleary's 3336).