Feeding Complex Paph to Foster Budset

[Ray]

Feeding and additives will NEVER promote blooming, whether you mean "promote" to mean "encourage" or "improve".

There is genetic programming involved here, and there isn't a damned thing any of us can do to trump that.

We can, however, do a great deal to negatively affect that - underfeeding, overfeeding, underwatering, overwatering, overheating, underheating, etc., etc., etc.

[JMNYC]

Originally Posted by Ray

Feeding and additives will NEVER promote blooming, whether you mean "promote" to mean "encourage" or "improve".

There is genetic programming involved here, and there isn't a damned thing any of us can do to trump that.

We can, however, do a great deal to negatively affect that - underfeeding, overfeeding, underwatering, overwatering, overheating, underheating, etc., etc., etc.

All of the above=dead on accurate! And you bet: my goal---a shared one here, I am sure--- is to never impede unwittingly, but always to augment!

Ray, the genetic legacy of the two pots of the no label multi floral Paph I put up....clearly identical. I did the division a year ago, so, I can testify to this. Both pots are growing in identical conditions, identical medium, etc.

It gets.....well, confusing.

[NYCorchidman]

I am also a bulldog (hate that nickname) fancier in NYC, although my focus is more on green and yellow type. I do have some spotted just for the sake of diversity and fun.

As Ray pointed out, I also do not believe in bloom booster. It is just a marketing scheme.

Complex paphs respond to seasonal change (day/ night length, and temperature drop, decreased or increased rain fall) to set buds, and many will set buds in late summer, which then come into bloom during the winter. Some will bloom in the early spring into even early summer depending on the climate given, but mostly it will be around winter into early spring.

Your comparion of just two plants do not really say anything. By the way, have you ever seen the flowers on that NOID?? Looks like white "bulldog" of some kind. White ones bloom whenever they feel like. lol

I use fertilizers with trace elements. Mine gets good light, some direct sun here and there, and good watering, which is very important for paphs.

One nursery claims "we push our paphs with water, not with fertilizers" and I totally agree with that statement.

You have a nice flower there!
I had really nice spotted one, but it got bad leaves and I had to toss it.
I still have two spotted ones, but nothing like the one I tossed regarding the flower quality. but they are healthy so far with no spots on the leaves.

[JMNYC]

I am also a bulldog (hate that nickname) fancier in NYC, although my focus is more on green and yellow type. I do have some spotted just for the sake of diversity and fun.

Ahah! I think you are smart enough to figure out how to mericlone Paphs! That is my dream! Cause then I will have an excuse to go completely insane buy all I want!

As Ray pointed out, I also do not believe in bloom booster. It is just a marketing scheme.

Wow. Well, if this is objectively true, color me self deluded. Cause over time, I became convinced my strategy works on all my Phals and my catt alliance plants. Self delusion is a very bad thing!

Your comparion of just two plants do not really say anything. By the way, have you ever seen the flowers on that NOID?? Looks like white "bulldog" of some kind. White ones bloom whenever they feel like. lol

I know, opposite of scientific. But yes, the division in the pot with the new bud has produced flowers twice. Not a bulldog, not a species....kinda muted pink pouch, OK but not impressively long, mottled petals....multifloral. When this bud (I circled in in red) matures and opens, I will be sure to
make pics.

You have a nice flower there!
I had really nice spotted one, but it got bad leaves and I had to toss it.
I still have two spotted ones, but nothing like the one I tossed regarding the flower quality. but they are healthy so far with no spots on the leaves.


Thanks so much! I am insane over it! I knew it would go high, but I was determined to get it. and, I esp like the balance of the segments....even that the dorsal is not huge; I think it's perfect.

So sorry about the spotted one you lost! As I posted, I once traded two fans of my precious Paph swallow 'karen' to Gene at Carter and Holmes for an actual two fan division of Winston Churchill 'Indomitable'...when he asked what I wanted in exchange, I took a deep breath and told him. It was a real act of courage for me to just ask, but he agreed! The next year, I went away, and my orchid tending surrogate messed up (many specimens) and I lost both. Truth is....I never recovered from this trauma. Nor....will I EVER.

[NYCorchidman]

Well, if this is going to be any surprise, I once stopped fertilizing for one year. I did not notice any difference.

Bloom booster is a marketing scheme because many people are "brain washed" about fertilizer simply as N for leaves, P for flowers, K for roots, which is sooo far from the truth! lol

By the way, is that bud always naturally dark like that? I thought it was a dead and dry bud sheath at a first glance.

Regarding paph, Winston Churchill, it is a very important hybrid. Well, the good news is it is not that hard to find because it grows like weeds.
There are always divisions around somewhere.

[JMNYC]

A YEAR? THAT....would make me way too anxious! Unless I found a way of replicating natural conditions in my apartment, i.e, bird droppings, the mineral rich elements just the humidity in the forest brings, and so forth.

Yes, the new bud is entirely normal for this Paph....they have dark mottling under the fur. EDIT: Just made a pic of the bud right now; you will see it is maturing perfectly; the stem is now visible.

U know....I also grow a huge collection of regular houseplants, several specimen size, all in luminous health, mostly also all found in the trash of this building, half dead, and I can tell you, re the few flowering plants....evolving fertilizing strategies including switching to bloom booster at a given juncture makes all the difference en the world!

Same deal on the Saintpaulias (african violets, also rescues) I grow! I only feed them dilute bloom booster; if I change to even balanced, that negatively impacts bloom bigtime! Pls ponder this.

Course regular houseplants don't care about nitrogen sources....they like urea.

Re Winston Churchill, indeed, possibly the most important pod parent ever. But, bet divisions still very expensive. Truth was, my Swallow 'karen" was rarer.

But I plan to stick to the progeny of Winston Churchill....and related hybrids as per my current obsession bulldog. Truth is, Winston Churchill's segments are not that flat and don't really have the harmony of the one above I simply had to have, which must have some WC somewhere back in its lineage. Remember, WC 'Indomitable' was awarded its FCC very long ago! Not sayin it isn't amazing, it is. Or else I would have asked for something else in trade. My dorsal is smaller, but well balanced and with bigger spots than either WC. I say, if you go for spots, go big or go home.

But, I will still never recover from that trauma. At the time, I was growing Paphs in (sit down) SHEET MOSS.
Seriously. And they did fabulously! It just made absolute sense to me. Gene at Carter and Holmes could almost not believe it, tho, being a classy guy, he was at least polite. But now, I use conventional bark mix with added organic matter/peat.

Let us know when you unearth the secret of mericloning Paphs! And please....HURRY!

Bud today, 5 mins ago:

[JMNYC]

Addendum to NYCorchidman:

I shoud share, I like "bulldogs" very much! Cause they actually do resemble bulldogs....and, while nobody discerning with a soul would ever buy an animal bred to be PATHOLOGICAL, re bulldogs, brachycephalic (read, purposeful and sadistic) dogs, and cats too, my building does not permit PETS.

So the Paph bulldogs are as close as I will ever get.

[JMNYC]

Update:

I deeply appreciate all the feedback in this thread....opinions, and clearly, from smart and experienced growers on this issue vary far more than I expected.

Do I believe bloom booster employed at carefully chosen junctures for our orchids is some insidious ploy of commerce? I do not.

We know orchids distinguish themselves by having adapted to daunting conditions over millenia.....but, should we exploit that by not chasing accurate data ongoing re culture, feeding? NO WAY.

So, toDAY, both pots of that no name Phal were scheduled for tending; each pot has around 5 mature fans all of which might be producing buds...rather than that one bud on #80.

I realized what my New plan was, as, after drenching the medium in both pots, I emersed both of them in pure bloom booster....while also silently encouraging ALL THE FANS on both to please start producing buds.

Maybe I am growing them too well and they are too chilled out. They say, reproducing, is, in part, a manifestation of some kinda stress for orchids. Do I believe that? Not sure.

When that one bud matures and opens and ripens ....I will make pics of it and put them up. In hopes someone might be able to tell me something about this hybrid!

Not something I would choose or give money for, but someone did. If they come my way, I am meant to save and grow them.

And, re my fabulous, more harmony and bigger dorsal spots than BOTH Winston Churchills bulldog (I don't even want another WC now).....I now plan on using a mixture of non urea Hi N and bloom booster even now, every other feeding.

It can't hurt and it might help.

We work to learn, we fiddle, we experiment, we observe....we chase those data to earn enlightenment. It's a journey.

Nobody loves computers more than I, but the richness of life is not enhanced by installing a solid state drive or having 16 GBs of DDR3 ram. Do I have both? Sure. (Tho not Haswell CPU.)

Fast.....is often the polar opposite of RICH.

[NYCorchidman]

Ok, now I can see the buds better, and as you say, it is very much alive and normal.
Given the appearance of the leaves and the buds, and you description of the flower color, I would assume this is a hybrid of multi and parvi of some sort?

My Delrosi is spiking at the moment and the bud is very dark as well.

Regarding Saintpaulia, I used to grow large selection as a kid, and I always used a balanced fertilizer.
They always bloomed like crazy. Bloom booster is a marketing scheme. The main thing that limit the blooming of African Violets given that plants are healthy which means they get adequate light and water, is the temperature. When it is too hot or too cool, the plants will stop flowering until warm temperature is resumed.

You can use pretty much anything for potting mix for orchids as long as your watering is adjusted.
Sheet moss will be great I would think. I use it to cover the top surface of certain plants and I love the look of it.

My building used to be pet free in the beginning, but then later gave up since there are simply way too many pet owners in the city.
No offence, but I find it highly annoying sometimes as some people (and their animals) are just not meant for urban living settings. lol

[JMNYC]

Originally Posted by NYCorchidman

Ok, now I can see the buds better, and as you say, it is very much alive and normal.
Given the appearance of the leaves and the buds, and you description of the flower color, I would assume this is a hybrid of multi and parvi of some sort?

Yes, normal bud.....tho why all the other mature fans aren't joining in, I do not know. Again, in the other pot.....lots of healthy, mature fans, not a bud in site. Perhaps any second! Or not.

Please know, I am a true cretin when it comes to identifying them, esp Paphs....but most of my NOIDS.

When this matures and opens and I make a pic....bet YOU will know a lot! For me, just not beautiful or remarkable in color or form; pink pouch but a kind of muddy pink. I feed bad just saying that. But it found me, and I grow them all with love.

(Again, and this is unique: for the life of me, I can not get multiquote here to work! I have no clue why.)

Re bloom booster......we might agree to disagree. I am positive it is no way some marketing ploy. Ask someone who grows vegetables (I don't, lol).

I only now grow saintpaulias, cause around 2 years ago, I came up 5 pots of very unwell ones on a service landing while I was was running down the stairs (takes way too long for the elevator guy to come up)

As always, seeing all of them regain health over time....then, one by one, discovering the reality of their respective blooms.....well very fun. Were I to feed them a balanced formula, they would do OK I think.....but what I do works so perfectly there is no reason for me to change it.

And, when my feeding regime for my Phals emerged as... start with bloom booster at the end of the summer thru to when the spikes are half mature.....it truly, honestly made a discernible difference!

I now only buy orchids when I am overtaken by blind lust. More than ever, I grow what comes my way; it's heady voyage of discovery!

Thanks so much for saying U don't think my having grown Phals in sheet moss was insane! They are terrestrial! They loved it!

And, at that time, I naturally potted up the two fan division of my Paph Swallow 'karen" to send to Gene at Carter and Holmes (in trade for my WC 'indomitable') using it.

When it arrived safely, in perfect health, he called (called not emailed) assuring me how thrilled he was, and, then, with great diplomacy said, "Well! the sheet moss is really interesting! But I immediately potted it in what WE use. (OMG....)

'Interesting" is often the greatest euphemism around among the uberly diplomatic. I thought it was hilarious.