Phal Spikes: To Cut of Not... - Orchid Board

zxyqu · #1 07-29-2009, 11:42 PM

Ok, before you all harass me about posting this question... I'm a scientist, and this is how I think, sorry. But does anyone know of any studies that have been done on Phals that compare the benefits/problems with cutting the spike versus leaving it on for more blooms. I can see the benefits of both, hoping for a few extra buds from a beautiful phal, or boosting the plant a little for the next spike, maybe 2 this time.
Anyone have a percentage of success on getting a secondary spike when you dont cut, or having compared cutting of one to not cutting another similar one?
If noone has compared them, I was hoping to propose a project, or more of an experiment, comparing a couple identical, or as close as possible, phals, cutting some and not cutting others and comparing the next round of blooms. The results would obviously be affected by growing medium/watering/fertilizer/weather/on/on/on, but I think it would shed some needed light on this oft asked question

. What say you OB, worth it or not?

Zoi2 · #2 07-30-2009, 12:08 AM

Sounds like a pretty fun experiment, but it sure will take a lot of time. I guess this could be an on going project?
Joann

zxyqu · #3 07-30-2009, 01:03 AM

Joann,
For sure. This will have to be at least a blooming season or 2 to get a good measure. I was hoping some people would chime in a say they have had a good chance of success with secondary spikes after not cutting it, but I think that's a variable of growing conditions and other variables. Maybe there is a published study out there someone has read that could solve this.
But I wouldn't mind hosting a project like this, not to mention who doesn't want an extra phal or 2 (or 8)in the window?? I could always convince my boss that it is a scientific experiment, and he'd probably buy it.

Zoi2 · #4 07-30-2009, 01:10 AM

I personally, have not had great results from keeping the spikes. I can usually get a couple more blooms, but I usually just cut the spike when the flowers drop. Most of my phals are noids--I wonder if a specie phal would do better? Count me in if you want to do a "project"--maybe your boss would spring for the cost?

Joann

zxyqu · #5 07-30-2009, 01:13 AM

Ha. I'd have a hard time convincing him that a mouse or human immune system would benefit from this project. That said, we do have some really nice windows that could use some "decorating

."
As to certain Phal hybrids, you may be right, maybe Dtps hybrids, or smaller bloom phals might do better than say the large standards... Yet another variable

. Have any thoughts on a phal you really want? (Acutally 4-8 you really want?)

Zoi2 · #6 07-30-2009, 01:22 AM

Other than your avitar phal?? ha ha
No, I can't think of any I specifically want---maybe the minis?
Actually, the human immune system works with orchids: None of us are immune!

Joann

Undergrounder · #7 07-31-2009, 11:55 AM

Well in my opinion I think it's quite simple, do flowers help an orchid grow or hinder it? Are they an energy source or an energy sink? Flowers have no chlorophyll, they take up a lot of energy to bloom, so no doubt they would use up more energy than they could possibly produce.

So cutting off an old spike could be nothing but good for the orchid's growth. I think if you want better flowers next year, cutting off old spikes is a good idea.

Just ask farmers who grow Phalaenopsis and Cymbidiums for the cut flower market. Do they cut off old stalks that couldn't be sold? I'm sure they do.

The only reason you would leave an old stalk on the plant is if you want more flowers NOW! but for the period that those extra flowers bloom you're not going to see much new growth and the plant would be set back a while.

Of course if you REALLY want good flowers in a particular year, cut off ANY spikes in the previous year and put all that energy into better spikes the next year.

That's also what commercial cut flower growers do when they get first-flowerings on immature plants. They don't want the small one or two flowers that come with the first flowering, so they cut off any new spikes until the plants are 5 years mature, meaning their plants grow faster.

Interestingly, i HAVE read a paper (just recently) that looked at the purpose of aerial roots and whether or not it was better to cut them off or leave them be. They concluded that they expended slightly more energy than they gain from photosynthesis or water/nutrient absorption from the air. Therefore they recommended you direct them back into the mix or cut them off entirely.

Undergrounder · #8 07-31-2009, 12:01 PM

Personally, i didn't cut off spikes but with one particular Phalaenopsis i did leave it in slightly low light conditions, such that it didn't flower for 2 years straight. It grew a total of 8 healthy, LARGE leaves in that period (it never lost a leaf either, so it still has 8 now).

This year, i moved it to a spot with higher light, and i'm pleased to say that it's double spiking, with at least 8 flowers on each spike that i can see so far (the spikes are still growing). The first year it flowered i only got 6 flowers on a single spike.

So yeah, if you want to get a plant awarded in a particular year or something, maybe it would be worth deliberately not flowering it for a few years and then BANG! Blast it with good light and low temps and see how many flowers you can get!

zxyqu · #9 07-31-2009, 12:02 PM

Wow. Can I get the citation on that paper. Was this study based on potting them or mounting. I would guess aerial roots may serve more or a purpose on mounts, but could easily see them be
more important in bracing against a tree. Good find undergrounder!

Undergrounder · #10 07-31-2009, 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zxyqu

Wow. Can I get the citation on that paper. Was this study based on potting them or mounting. I would guess aerial roots may serve more or a purpose on mounts, but could easily see them be
more important in bracing against a tree. Good find undergrounder!

Sure

The study looked at both i think, but it was more to do with roots that aren't being used for support i think.

I didn't realise it was as old as it is.

The Role of the Velamen of the Aerial Roots of Orchids
Augustus M. Dycus and Lewis Knudson
Botanical Gazette, Vol. 119, No. 2 (Dec., 1957), pp. 78-87
(article consists of 10 pages)
Published by: The University of Chicago Press
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