Opionions about Dendrophylax lindenii needed.

[K-Sci]

It has been decades since I grew this orchid, and when I did I wasn't successful with it. This is probably because it required more heat and light than I could provide in coastal Washington state.

I'm contemplating buying a flask of these fascinating plants. Should I? I'm thinking they would like the hot humid summers in central Mississippi, but perhaps not.

-Keith

---------- Post added at 10:53 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:38 PM ----------

Too late. I bought the flask.
They will need to be plated when received. Any advice would be welcome.

-Keith

[estación seca]

I've never tried growing it. But based on everything I've read here you should throw away the flask when it arrives to save yourself the aggravation.

[camille1585]

There are some very good threads created by someone who very sucessfully grew ghost orchids. I think these are the ones:

Ghost orchids, I found a way

Dendrophylax Lindenii - Ghost Orchid

Good luck, I think you're about to attempt the Mount Everest of the orchid world!

[RJSquirrel]

I tried one once that was grown in a little glass jar mounted on a stick from Andys orchids.

looked dead already bec its just a root.

took away some of the pain a few months later,

when I found out it was dead all along

good luck

[Ray]

I’ve never tried growing it, but I’ll share the “helpful” info I’ve read.

One very good grower found they did better on a mesh substrate (coated hardware cloth) then a normal, “flat” one. The speculation being that when you weave the roots through the mesh, the plant is immediately more mechanically stable and “comfortable” that it would be slapped onto the surface of a board or cork.

EFG orchids did very well with them inside a mostly-enclosed “tank”. Lots of sun, saturated humidity, pretty much zero air movement. Yet, I have heard from others that they are exposed to strong air movement in the wild. I have never been to the Fakahatchee Stand area, but other parts of the Everglades seemed pretty stagnant.

[K-Sci]

Originally Posted by Ray

...One very good grower found they did better on a mesh substrate (coated hardware cloth) then a normal, “flat” one.

This makes some sense b/c it would allow complete air movement, though there would be no little or no nutrients from the substrate. Nutrients would have to be provided by another means, such as a very dilute complete fertilizer.

I'm wondering if a little Kelpak would be an beneficial. I see that some have tried Superthrive.

From the online sources that have tried to grow these the best idea appears to be to try a mix of different methods at once with the hope that one of them succeeds.

EFG orchids did very well with them inside a mostly-enclosed “tank”. Lots of sun, saturated humidity, pretty much zero air movement.

At this point, I think a tank, a terrarium of sorts, makes sense, but a lot of sun, no air movement, and an enclosed environment? I'm wondering how that would that be done without resulting in very high temperatures.

Yet, I have heard from others that they are exposed to strong air movement in the wild. I have never been to the Fakahatchee Stand area, but other parts of the Everglades seemed pretty stagnant.

Keeping air movement low is a goal mentioned by several that have tried to grow this species, some with success, and some not.

Increased evaporation rates and preventing infection are the only two mechanisms of action I can think of that high air movement provides. It makes no sense that a plant would be intolerant of air movement in a saturated environment where there would be little or no evaporation. In an enclosed movement, a gas buildup is possible, but in an environment with pathways to external air, diffusion should assure the necessary gas exchange.

I'm not of the belief that mother nature should be emulated for orchids, especially seed, beyond providing for the basic needs such as air, light, and temperature. If you read the early accounts of the attempts to grow orchids, they killed a lot of orchids trying to emulate nature. In the early attempts to grow C. walkeriana, for example, they believed they took moisture from the air and without water the pants died. In many early efforts they rotted orchids with warm, humid, but stagnant environments.

Mother nature kills many millions just to obtain one organism survivor. Many of the orchids growing in the wild are just barely surviving. Nature doesn't provide anything remotely like a sterile environment or nutrient rich plating media No natural environments have 24-7 moving air, but stagnant air is certainly possible in micro climates. Wind sheltered microclimates would also tend allow little light. This species appears to need bright light to thrive.

-Keith

---------- Post added at 09:47 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:18 AM ----------

Originally Posted by camille1585

There are some very good threads created by someone who very sucessfully grew ghost orchids. I think these are the ones:

Ghost orchids, I found a way

Dendrophylax Lindenii - Ghost Orchid

Good luck, I think you're about to attempt the Mount Everest of the orchid world!

From these I get the following:

- You do not have to mimic the Everglades.

- They do best if grown to a size with 3" roots before de-flasking.

-When you mount the orchid it must be with new growth down. This may be virtually essential.

- It may help to tie the roots down on the mount with dental tape. It is flat and seems to hold well without cutting into the roots.

- Cork mounts seems to dry out too fast, Cypress appears to be a better choice.

- The mount needs to be one that doesn't deteriorate easily. It may be best to mount the mount rather than remove plants and remount.

- They can be grow outdoors with stippled morning sun and indirect bright light the rest of the day.

- Using rainwater or another purified low-mineral water has resulted in success.

- Success has been achieved using dilute Orca Premium Liquid Mycorrhizae (available on eBay). In one case at 5 drops per quart, and in another 6 drops per pint of rainwater in a spray bottle once a week. Potentially alternating weeks with 1/4 strength MSU.

- Success has been achieved watering (not just misting) 3 - 4 time a day.

Additional links from the links provided:

Dendrophylax lindenii - '''The Ghost Orchid''' (syn. Polyrrhiza lindenii) - OrchidWeb

https://www.aos.org/AOS/media/Conten...hidFeature.pdf

-Keith

---------- Post added at 10:46 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:47 AM ----------

The initial plan.

I will recieve some 80 mericloned spread stage 4N orchids in an Erlenmeyer flask. The original mother plant was from Andy's.

The flask will probably need to be re-flasked shortly after receipt due mixing caused by shock/vibration in transport. The plants will be grown in new media until they have 3" roots.

I'm purchasing the replate meda from the seller to mix with RO water in mason jars to be sterilized with a pressure cooker.

To ventilate the jars, my initial plan is to sterilize the jar tops and a sharp punch using 98% isopropyl or physan hen poke a holes in the jar top after cooling. The hole could be covered with a circular Bandaid.

It may not be necessary to be this careful with sterilization, but I'm thinking that relasking could be done in a Phyasan sterilized 20-tall aquarium with a heavy plastic covering and alcohol sterilized gloves.

Any suggestions on better methods are welcome.

-Keith

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[Ray]

Originally Posted by K-Sci

This makes some sense b/c it would allow complete air movement, though there would be no little or no nutrients from the substrate. Nutrients would have to be provided by another means, such as a very dilute complete fertilizer.

I'm wondering if a little Kelpak would be an beneficial. I see that some have tried Superthrive.

I doubt they get much in the way of nutrition from the substrate, no matter what it is.

Certainly Kelpak would be better than a simple hormone supplement.

[estación seca]

Recall orchids in habitat live with endosymbiont fungi. It is likely the fungi are very important for the orchid. If the fungal hyphae extend outside the orchid they will be able to import minerals and other nutrients the orchid might otherwise have trouble getting.

Cycads live with endosymbiont cyanobacteria, which are able to fix gaseous nitrogen and provide nitrogen to the cycads in low-nutrition environments. Cycads have specialized coralloid roots to host the cyanobacteria.

Many cacti in habitat look as though they are heavily fertilized with nitrogen. But there is very little nitrogen in their environment. Cyanobacteria called Nostoc live in most desert environments. They are easy to find. During the dry season look for a thin crust of dark organic matter in areas where water would linger longest after rain. It has been hypothesized for years that this is the source of nitrogen for the cacti but it has not been studied.

[K-Sci]

Originally Posted by estación seca

Recall orchids in habitat live with endosymbiont fungi....

I was just contemplating the possibility that this orchid doesn't do well out of the flask unless it has attained a fairly large size owing to a lack of the essential fungi when taken off the artificial nutrient source. The question is what to do with this. Spray the plants with pureed orchid tissue when deflasking (only half kidding)?
-Keith

[Roberta]

If they are big enough to deflask, they have already incorporated anything that they need. (They don't have leaves but they have chlorophyll in their roots - and make their own food.) Fledglings ready to fly. If they haven't developed that far, they aren't big enough to deflask. If you replate them, your bigger challenge will be to prevent contamination from fungi, etc. in the air that overwhelm them in their new flask.