Very Limited Anecdotal Evidence/Coincidence, but... - Page 3 - Orchid Board

camille1585 · #21 03-07-2022, 08:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ray

I've got to say, I don't show plants, but if this holds (no pun intended), this could be a boon to those who do.

Today’s image.

3 open blooms at once, now that's a really great side effect of kelpak! I think I'll test this myself next time one of my sequntially blooming slippers blooms (or even on Phal equestris- I have one now in bud).
For showing, if you want to have your plant judged is the use of products that artificially enhance the plant allowed?

thefish1337 · #22 03-07-2022, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ray

In many cases, foliar application is exactly what's done. The guy that used to own the US distributorship for the US owns a winery and he sprays his vines to get the rachis to elongate, allowing better spacing for fruit development and especially the penetration of fungicides.

The problem with foliar treatments in orchids - and not all orchids - is the waxy cuticle layers on the leaves. An evolutionary adaptation to reduce water loss, the cutex is a barrier that slows uptake as well. Plants with relatively thick, fleshy leaves - phalaenopsis, cattleya-types, vandas, many dendrobiums, etc. - tend to have the thicker cutices. However, they apparently develop more and more with age, suggesting immature specimens of those plants are more easily able to absorb via the foliar route.

While foliar application in orchids may be less than ideal compared to thin-leaved fast growing plants, there are some things you can do. Appropriate pH (PH 5.8-6.5), use of an appropriate wetting agent, timing of application and the use of low ppm/soft water all can aid in the delivery of a a foliar payload. if you had a large collection and wanted to get even crazier you could buy a consumer model of a fogger which atomizes the water and delivers the solution as superfine droplets that absorb much better.

Recommended wetting agents:
-polysorbate 20 (0.05%-0.1% concentration)
-cocowet (0.05%-0.1% concentration or label rate)
-therm x-70 yucca extract (label recommendations)
-quillaja powder

stonedragonfarms · #23 03-07-2022, 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by camille1585

3 open blooms at once, now that's a really great side effect of kelpak! I think I'll test this myself next time one of my sequntially blooming slippers blooms (or even on Phal equestris- I have one now in bud).
For showing, if you want to have your plant judged is the use of products that artificially enhance the plant allowed?

So long as you are not physically altering the blooms [ie trimming, compensating for color break, etc.] I can't foresee why you this wouldn't be allowed [in broad terms artificial enhancement is already condoned--staking spikes, 'facing' paphs, staging spike scapes, etc., are all strategies employed to make plants more presentable & maximize individual bloom growth & presentation...]
I can see where some will quibble about it causing an unfair advantage [likely from those artificially vernalizing Cyps or thereabouts

]

RoseSD · #24 03-11-2022, 12:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ray

Actually, it’s not.

Hormones only make up a small percentage of the active ingredients.

I have come to the conclusion that it’s sort of the equivalent of a “plant IV”, giving the plant a lot of the same stuff it would produce for itself, without the need to expend its own resources to do so.

Kelpak has been around for 40 years and has been used on just about every food/nut/fruit crop known, plus turf and landscaping. There is a wealth of info on their website, but none about its use on orchids, as I am apparently the first to try it (at the time, nobody at the manufacturer had any orchid experience, either), so I’m sure there are some interesting benefits we haven’t “discovered”.

Is Kelpak significantly different from either Superthrive or CleanKelp?
Is the concentration you used about 1 teaspoon in 1 gallon?

Ray · #25 03-11-2022, 08:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RoseSD

Is Kelpak significantly different from either Superthrive or CleanKelp?
Is the concentration you used about 1 teaspoon in 1 gallon?

Yes, it is significantly different.

Superthrive primarily relies on a synthetic hormone for its stimulating action. It contains some vitamins and in a recent addition (the stuff has been around for decades) a kelp extract, but best I can tell, they are present primarily for the mineral nutrient value.

Cleankelp is interesting, as it contains extracts of several different species of kelp including some of the same one used in KelpMax/Kelpak, and algae. I cannot speak for the value of all of the ingredients, but they use a crushing technique to extract the juices, which has been shown to degrade some of the more complex phytochemicals.

I recommend that Kelpak be used at a tablespoon per gallon (1:256). According to the manufacturer, Kelpak used at a dilution of 1:500 or less (1 tsp/gal is 1:768) is worthless.

DirtyCoconuts · #26 03-11-2022, 10:41 AM

this is not scientific info here but i realized that i have been finishing my orchid sprayer in the same area of my yard and i spray the last "hot" spray on the other plants in that area....this is probably for more than a year.
there is a mango tree and a sugar apple and a few butterfly plants
i just noticed today that the part of the mango tree i spray is covered in flowers and the rest is empty and the sugar apple tree which is only 8 ' gave me three fruit last year and has 200+ flowers on it this year.

this is all foliar application but i think it supports Ray's first comment that this stuff has unlimited uses and is really really good LOL

also, there is a cocktail citrus tree that i do NOT spray bc it is typically a spider heaven and i garden at night, it is not as dramatically improved

Ray · #27 03-11-2022, 02:02 PM

For what it's worth, since retiring and moving to North Carolina, where my yard is loaded with palms, cycads, and all sorts of flowering plants and I have a great deal more time to "mess with" them, I have used my Kelpak/Quantum/K-Lite regimen on everything with great results.

Herbs, tomatoes, my lone fig tree, annuals, perennials, and my bay laurel all get supplemental osmocote in the spring, but get "the regimen" components whenever I apply them to the orchids.

tmoney · #28 03-13-2022, 12:05 AM

i would also back up some of the kelpak claims with my own anectdotal evidence. with the regular application bi weekly, i do see improvement in my plants (non-orchids as well), but misting aerial roots with the recommended dilution gives immediate, noticeable results. this is now how i prefer to apply kepak. spraying leaves gives too much residue, so i don't do that anymore...

love kelpak! just ordered another bottle last week!

RoseSD · #29 03-13-2022, 01:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tmoney

i would also back up some of the kelpak claims with my own anectdotal evidence. with the regular application bi weekly, i do see improvement in my plants (non-orchids as well), but misting aerial roots with the recommended dilution gives immediate, noticeable results. this is now how i prefer to apply kepak. spraying leaves gives too much residue, so i don't do that anymore...

love kelpak! just ordered another bottle last week!

Dilution of 1tbs per gallon?

tmoney · #30 03-14-2022, 12:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RoseSD

Dilution of 1tbs per gallon?

it was rays rec of 1:250, but i usually mix it at 20 ml to 5 L cause i put other ferts in there as well. this winter i cut out the application of kelpmax, both spray and water, and just gave the first application again last week...at about 15 ml per 5L. in summer we did and plan on doing bi weekly

edit: sorry, i gave up imperial when i moved....and metric is easier!! hahahahah