Adventures in KelpMax

[camille1585]

Originally Posted by tmoney

my bottle of kelpak (from the netherlands distributor) looks much different than that

and im starting to wonder which form we have, because ours is brownish liquid.

I have a bottle from the same place as you, and I poured some into a falcon tube to check. It is definitely more brown than green!

I have to order more soon, and I can ask them about the different formulations.

[Ray]

Originally Posted by K-Sci

Sometimes it amazes me how easily I can miss the obvious. I've been thinking of TDS as a poorly defined measure of ion content, completely missing the simplicity of the measure.

You ain’t alone.

About 15 years ago or so, when I became aware of the MSU fertilizers, I started having a great many conversations with the PhD that formulated them, and has been a great plant-nutrition resource over the years. Early on, he expressed wonder/confusion/concern over the fact that orchid growers appeared to be the only group that used “TDS” at all.

Based upon that, I started doing some calculations, ended up calculating the ion concentrations as did you, but wondered “what am I missing?”, as they did not total to 100%.

Then I came to realize the flaw with TDS meters, so wrote it off to that.

Honestly, it was only within the last couple of years that I finally grasped the reality!

Originally Posted by Shadeflower

It's clealry not the same product as mine raises my EC far more than Keith's Kelpmax.

Shadeflower, that’s brilliant! In problem solving - something I have trained people in for decades - the very first question to be asked is “what’s different?” Or “what has changed?”, yet that never occurred to me. I knew Kelp Products made a fertilizer blend, but was not aware they still called it Kelpak.

Roberta, thanks for taking the time to clarify.

[Shadeflower]

you could call it good brain storming or even teamwork.
Just took Keith to pop into his greenhouse for 2 minutes. For Roberta to find the relevant product specs
And we are all happier we discovered why there has been confusion in the past.

I wish it were easier to source but I still believe it is really powerful so a little goes a long way and will last for years.

[SADE2020]

Originally Posted by Shadeflower

Thanks for the research Roberta. This is why I have been so confused. There are different formulations.



That has been my problem in the past I think so SADE I think you have the same as me which has added Nutrients.

Ps: Interesting to hear you use Orchid Focus! I'm just trying it out. Am running a comparrison on a couple of orchids to see which is better, my own mix or theirs. I erally like that it is so easy to use, it even buffers my rain water so I don't have to adjust the PH. It's also the only fertilizer I have found that contains enough Iron.
So far I am really impressed but we'll see how it performs. I know you have really healthy orchids Sade and MissOrchidgirl started all her success on Orchid Focus too so it must be pretty good.

The Kepax I use is very green and
you can smell the seaweed.

@Shade ..Focus Fertilizer is one of the best in the world, no doubt. My mom, sister in her shop, everyone uses it. We all give it a break, stop and change it for a 20.20.20 two time per year, so the plant doesn't get used to it. (Not for the OrchidGirl that I can stand hahaha) My mom said that using the same for a long time tricks the cells to absorb the nutrients. I am not into chemistry I follow my guts and TestAB and compared with other stuff it works great for me.

[K-Sci]

From the conversations I assume that Orchid Focus is an EU phenomenon.

Speaking of products with names that confuse or mislead, the insecticide 'Seven' used to be carbaryl, but is now this or other insecticides marketed under the same name.

-Keith

[Shadeflower]

Originally Posted by K-Sci

From the conversations I assume that Orchid Focus is an EU phenomenon.

I would call it a little known secret. We'll see. It's good but I've yet to put it to the test properly. I've seen reviews show mainly phalaenopsis grown with it that are all really healthy.

so what's good about it? It contains seaweed, buffers the ph, contains fulvic and humic acid, plenty of Calcium, has a good ratio of nutrients(I already mentioned the higher Iron compared to others, eg 4 times more than Rainmix for example).
So what's bad about it: to be determined lol but it is very weak so 10ml is roughly the equivalent of 1g of Rainmix ie if you are used to adding 5 grams of Rainmix to a bucket you'd need 50ml of Orchid Focus to get the same concentration. 1 liter at the recommended dose of 2ml/liter will only make 50 buckets of feed which needs to be used at every single watering (it is weak) so a 1 liter bottle would not even last me a year. That's the downside.

If someone asked me what the easiest foolproof fertilizer for a handful of phals would be it would be Orchid Focus. No ph meter needed. No tds really needed either, the instructions are spot on (which is rare for an orchid fertilizer)

But it might be expensive long term. That is why I decided to see if I can replicate the fertilizer or even get better results.

If anyone is interested, 0.6g Rainmix + 0.3 ml PK 13/14 per gallon of water should roughly equal the Orchid Focus at the recommended dose but then you still have to add seaweed extract, humic and fulvic acid, possibly some micro nutrients, then you have to adjust the ph.

To replicate the Orchid Focus Bloom would be roughly 0.6g Rainmix + 0.6ml PK 13/14 per gallon.

ps: PK 13/14 is a fertilizer available from many different brands containing 13% phosporous and 14% potassium

[SADE2020]

Originally Posted by Shadeflower

I would call it a little known secret. We'll see. It's good but I've yet to put it to the test properly. I've seen reviews show mainly phalaenopsis grown with it that are all really healthy.

so what's good about it? It contains seaweed, buffers the ph, contains fulvic and humic acid, plenty of Calcium, has a good ratio of nutrients(I already mentioned the higher Iron compared to others, eg 8 times more than Rainmix for example).
So what's bad about it: to be determined lol but it is very weak so 10ml is roughly the equivalent of 1g of Rainmix ie if you are used to adding 5 grams of Rainmix to a bucket you'd need 50ml of Orchid Focus to get the same concentration. 1 liter at the recommended dose of 2ml/liter will only make 50 buckets of feed which needs to be used at every single watering (it is weak) so a 1 liter bottle would not even last me a year. That's the downside.

If someone asked me what the easiest foolproof fertilizer for a handful of phals would be it would be Orchid Focus. No ph meter needed. No tds really needed either, the instructions are spot on (which is rare for an orchid fertilizer)

But it might be expensive long term. That is why I decided to see if I can replicate the fertilizer or even get better results.

If anyone is interested, 0.6g Rainmix + 0.3 ml PK 13/14 per gallon of water should roughly equal the Orchid Focus at the recommended dose but then you still have to add seaweed extract, humic and fulvic acid.

To replicate the Orchid Focus Bloom would be roughly 0.6g Rainmix + 0.6ml PK 13/14 per gallon.

ps: PK 13/14 is a fertilizer available from many different brands containing 13% phosporous and 14% potassium

Well, I do have bunch of phals ...but I doubt they are the only one benefits from it, the Cymb and Catts as well. I use automatic misting and for me is essential a fluid formula, since Rainmix and others don't dissolve well, also a formula that is not very aggressive; with no harmful history and available in my area. There are several nurseries in EU with great formulas..but in between shipping and all is not worthy.

I don't relay much in fertilizer, clearly your method and needs are very different than mine, but I am sure we are both right . I do fertilize very small amount but steady, 3 On + 1 Off; AOS old style. After too much reading here and others growers advice and now speaking for myself, I don't belive that the plants need that many added-on in order to change the end result if the rest of the basics needs are working properly.

PD: I'll give example of this in the 3 very dehydrated phals thread...

Cheers!

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[Shadeflower]

Originally Posted by SADE2020

I don't relay much in fertilizer, clearly your method and needs are very different than mine, but I am sure we are both right

I was saying you can hardly be wrong using the Focus

I do spend too much time thinking about what some might consider trivial but I blame all the manufacturers not being able to agree on what to use. The difference is mindblowing amongst different orchid blends. If you are lucky enough to start off with a bulletproof fertilizer you'd never realize how many problems you could have if you didn't.

some are designed for rainwater, some for tap water but then they don't tell you that on the label!
Some recommend far higher concentrations to others and that's before you get into the different NPK ratio's available which can't all be right if they are all different.