Water with plain water first before fertilizing?

[SouthPark]

It is true that a lot of us here, including me - are not professional growers. But I think some of us have been growing for as long as (or more) ----- and have as much experience as professional growers. So the techniques/procedures some of us have 'converged' to - ----- works well, or very well - over very long periods of time --- which is definitely important too.

But - now that I come to think of it - and knowing about 'grass roots' - and giving credit ------ my fairly early experience and methods (when getting used to growing orchids) --- came from a professional orchid nursery grower - who started me off, and put me on a good track.

And I also observe - at orchid nurseries - and knowing orchid nursery growers ------ know about how they do various things too.

It is good form to respect other people's way of doing (controlling) things - especially when it works nicely for them for very long periods of time.

[Ray]

I think a lot of professional growers use the “water first” technique primarily because “we’ve always done it that way”. Professionals are intent on growing and selling, and many are not willing-, or don’t have the time to experiment with what they know works.

My first exposure to orchid growing, 50 years ago, when I volunteered at what is now the Atlanta Botanical Garden, included watering first, then feeding.

I think one-time fertigation is closer to what the plants see in nature and is less wasteful, but both techniques work.

[SouthPark]

For some media, and some potting styles ------ I think that - even if we only manually add 'fertiliser' occasionally ----- then it's possible that the fertiliser hangs around, so that when we do regular watering, then it's possible for the roots/plant to still get something.

[Fairorchids]

Note:

I water with a hose, pouring water on large hanging baskets for 5-10 seconds each. It takes me approx. 3 hours to water the entire greenhouse.

I fertilize with a hose end sprayer, with the dial set at 4.5. We use some 12-15 refills of the sprayer supply bottle, and the full application takes about 35-40 minutes.

That type of 'injection' can't be set low enough to do a single application, that both provides enough water, and a low enough dosage to use it in every watering.

[SouthPark]

Originally Posted by Fairorchids

I belong to 'B' group.

I'm sort of (or mostly) in the 'B' group too.

[Ray]

Originally Posted by Fairorchids

I fertilize with a hose end sprayer, with the dial set at 4.5. We use some 12-15 refills of the sprayer supply bottle, and the full application takes about 35-40 minutes.

That type of 'injection' can't be set low enough to do a single application, that both provides enough water, and a low enough dosage to use it in every watering.

I really don’t understand that.

If that is, I assume, 4.5 ounces per gallon, and the sprayer tank hold a quart, you can certainly make a low-concentration/high-volume spray. Let’s say use used MSU RO fertilizer and wanted 25 ppm N. That means you’d need 0.7 g powder per 4.5 ounces in the tank. 32/4.5=7.11, so you’d put 0.7 x 7.11 = 4.977 g (roughly a teaspoon) in the quart tank and fill it with water, and you’d get a bit more than 7 gallons final solution per tankful.

[isurus79]

As Ray mentioned, watering first is an old fashioned technique that was used when fertilizers were too strong for the plants. Now we know better. Watering once with an appropriate amount of fertilizer is a more efficient (i.e. less time and money spent on fertilizing) manner of delivering nutrients to the plants. Watering first is a relict of the past that is disappearing, much like bloom boosters.

---------- Post added at 12:02 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:01 PM ----------

Originally Posted by Fairorchids

B. Most water (drench) with pure water, and fertilize occasionally.

I don't think this is what the OP was talking about.

[Roberta]

The "water first" approach may work OK where there is medium that will stay wet and hold some fertilizer that will remain accessible to the plant after it dries out somewhat by the next watering (sort of a time-release approach)... Plants that need to stay wet, like Bulbophylums will be OK with it.

But, "OK" is not "ideal" ... think of what an epiphytic orchid actually evolved to do in nature for maximum efficiency... when it first starts to rain is when there are the maximum nutrients washing down on the plant, so it has evolved to grab those with the first drops of water... when the roots are dry to start. Of course, that natural "fertlizer" - from rotting plant materials, bird poop, etc - is very dilute. You should be fertilizing with very dilute mix anyway... Ideal is extremely dilute every watering, a compromise with practicaity is a little more (like 1/2 to 1/4 of what is on the bottle) once a week or so. But still, let the plant grab the nutrients first thing, then water as normal. Mother Nature knows best!

[SouthPark]

Originally Posted by Fairorchids

Note:

For my once-a-month relatively weak fertiliser scheme, and also once-a-month relatively weak mag-cal scheme (where I apply 2 weeks after the fertiliser ------ I just do this, as I just assumed at one stage that I should keep things separate, even though it might be ok to just apply both at the same time) ------ and then water the orchids at all other times of the month with regular tap water ------- I can see that it is absolutely enough for my orchid media/pot and environment setup --- because the leaves and bulbs of some of the big-size catts here are massive and really healthy, and probably couldn't get any bigger (in size) ----- their leaves and bulbs that is.

I think that - just because I fertilise 'once' a month ---- it probably doesn't mean that it is a one-shot thing. The fertiliser - or traces of it - or something, still hangs around within the pot - in among the media. So the plant probably does get something into it ------ at least sometimes, whenever I apply regular water.

But I also think that the 'weak' fertiliser method - for every watering ------ is certainly workable too. It's just that ----- you got to make up that mix, or keep having it on supply (or tap) ----- for every watering time. Which is ok. As long as the grower is fine with it, then no problem.

For 'semi-hydro' ----- or maybe small seedlings in small pots with not too many roots etc, the situation might be different --- so weak fertiliser application at every watering ----- or every re-charging of water might be beneficial for those cases.

[K-Sci]

Originally Posted by Fairorchids

Guys,

B. Most water (drench) with pure water, and fertilize occasionally.
...

Then, after watering, we fertilize with a fairly high dose every 2 weeks (again, reducing dosage in the middle of winter).
...
With this regimen, I get far better growth results than anyone else I know (hobby or commercial grower).

I love how reality and truth have a way of asserting themselves. The truth being that which corresponds to reality. As your bank will tell you, there is no 'your truth' or 'my truth', there are only what's true and what isn't true with nothing in between.

I fertilized once per month with Miracid, a 30-10-10-0-0 urea-based formulation, at 1/4 tsp per gallon for over 4 decades with reasonably good results. I think I got better results when I started fertilizing weekly, but with the heat of the summer (95F day, 75F night) at every watering. But that may, in truth, be because I also changed to a regime containing calcium and magnesium, mostly MSU 13-3-15-10-3, but with some K-lite 12-1-1-10-3 from time to time.

There is obviously such a thing as "too much" or "too little" but there seems to be a big range in between. I think it is likely that the orchids do just as well with a wide variation in fertilizer compositions, but that's just my best guess, not what I would call a truth.

-Keith