Hybrid Question

[tuvoc]

Ross, in the case of a an orchid plant, as well as most other plants, there are both sexes present in each individual, so it doesn't matter if the plant is used as the mother or father, each one could be used as either, the genetic material in the pollen, or the ovary, is the same. If you self a plant, it is both mother and father. If you cross A with B, or B with A, A could be either the mother or the father, as could B.

Kim

[Tindomul]

Originally Posted by TheNewGuy

So is everyone saying that you could make a new hybrid by just switching the roles of the parents? Or is it like the children of humans? Everyone's a little different?

I think that Dorothy is right with her statement. Because, I have characteristics that my parents don't have, but my grandparents have. I'm sure that it's similar.

Exactly. Its the same plant but they are as different as you are to your siblings. If you cross a chimp with a human you still get a chimpman regardless of which species was the mother and father. God forbid.

[Tindomul]

Originally Posted by Dorothy

If they are hybirds with an assortment of genes from a long lineage, can it end up with characteristics not present in the parents but ones from other hybrids in it's genealogy?

All the genes that the kids have have to come from one of the parents. However, the expression of those genes can be very different from the expression of the genes of the parents. So in essence the answer is yes. Perhaps both parents had the gene for white blooms but both had non white blooms, and only when both the father plant and mother plant donated their white flower gene did the offspring get white blooms, a feature not seen in either parent. I simplified the case though.

[Dorothy]

Exactly, recessive traits ..

Goatboy talking about chimpmen ..

[Tindomul]

Originally Posted by Dorothy

Exactly, recessive traits ..

Goatboy talking about chimpmen ..

[shakkai]

I am not sure if it is the case with orchids, but I do know that some traits in plants are only inheritable from the pod parent (mother). Variegation is one that spring to mind... So sometimes it is important which is used for pollen (father) and which for pod (mother). However, with orchids, the grex name would be the same.

[Paul]

Anytime a cross made, irrespective of which parent is "mom" or "dad" there is always the opportunity for variation amongst the offspring. This is a result of gene mixing and possible mutations in the chromosomes.

Originally Posted by Ross

Kim, for those of us genetically challenged I think this means one set might have frilly lips if father was a frill. But if mother was a frill, maybe not. One set of offspring might have red lips while if parents reversed the petals might be white. Is this basically the idea?

Unless the trait happened to be sex-linked, then dominance or recessiveness of genes would have nothing to do with which parent was the pollen donor or egg donor. Some traits are sex-linked meaning that the genes for that trait are located on the X or Y chromosome. As a result the trait tends to only be expressed in one sex. For example, color blindness (due to genetics) is far more common in men than women. It is a recessive sex-linked trait & is found on the X chromosome. (Yes the X) Men have only one X, women have 2. Because of this, if a man inherits the recessive gene from his mother, he will be color-blind. His father can't give him an X only a Y so there is no dominant "normal" color gene to overpower the recessive. Women, however, in order to be color blind would have to receive 2 of these "defective" genes -- one from each parent. A much lower likelihood. (In fact 8% of the male population is color blind but only 1 out of 200 women are)

Do keep in mind that many traits do not exhibit simple dominant-recessive inheritance. For example, eye color in humans actually depend upon more than just one pair of genes -- hence the variety of eye color (like the existence of more than one shade of brown for eye color)

Originally Posted by Dorothy

If they are hybirds with an assortment of genes from a long lineage, can it end up with characteristics not present in the parents but ones from other hybrids in it's genealogy?

Most definitely. If the trait in question is recessive and both parents have that recessive gene and a dominant one for that trait then neither parent will display that trait. However if an offspring should so happen to inherit the recessive version from each parent, then that recessive trait will be expressed in that individual

Originally Posted by TheNewGuy

So is everyone saying that you could make a new hybrid by just switching the roles of the parents?

No the hybrid is still the same. A donkey mated to a horse always gives a mule no matter which is the mom and which is the dad.

Originally Posted by TheNewGuy

Or is it like the children of humans? Everyone's a little different?

Exactly that.

[Tindomul]

Originally Posted by Paul

Unless the trait happened to be sex-linked,

This is unlikely to be the reason as most orchid, most plants are monoecious (have both sexes in the same flower).

[Paul]

Originally Posted by Tindomul

This is unlikely to be the reason as most orchid, most plants are monoecious (have both sexes in the same flower).

On that I do agree though it seemed worth mentioning in conjunction with the questions posed.

Matters are further complicated in plants as they are more likely to survive -- sometimes even thrive -- with extra chromosomes. A situation that is usually deadly in higher order animals

[TheNewGuy]

Okay, another couple of questions.

Say you have my previously stated hybrid the den. 'Hawaii' from a den. phal X den. tokai. How likely is it that another hybrid from the same parents would be genetically the same as the original hybrid.

And what if you got another Hawaii but from a different set of parents, would the genetic make up be the same as the first hybrid created?